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Hi Ya C!
I want to teach you something VERY VERY important and it is extremely difficult to do when choosing someone to fall in love. The number 1 or 2 reason people get divorced is poor communication. When you are dating someone and considering them as a potential person to go through life with long term, your radar needs to be on high alert. You need to be VERY clear as to what you want, how you are treated and MOST importantly, how you both handle stress or challenge together. Dr. John Gottman found in his 20 year study of relationships….the happy marriages that lasted were the ones where they respected and honored and were kind to each other EVEN WHEN THINGS WERE HARD. I cannot emphasize enough how crucial it is to really watch how you are treated when hurt feelings show up. You must hold yourself accountable as well! When you have 2 people, even in anger and hurt, who treat each other with respect….then you have a couple with a good, strong foundation!! You guys only dated 3 weeks and you already saw how quickly he disconnected. That is a guy who most likely will not stick around or will shut down when something challenging happens in the relationship or you disappoint him. YES! Always pay attention to their relationship with parents! Not to say that he couldn’t be different than his dad, but that definitely raises a big caution flag with his dad being his best friend and role model!
You guys obviously had a strong connection. I would challenge you to slow this down A LOT! You say you loved him….has he earned your heart that way? I would invite you to protect your heart for much longer and take things slower. Keep it close to you as that is the most valuable part of who you are. Make sure that before you open up to the level of “love” that you have spent quite a bit of time with someone, seen them under stress and how they respond, met their friends, their family and vise versa and you really watch and see how you both interact together. STRONG chemistry, affection and intimacy does not mean love. It just means strong chemistry, intimacy and affection. Love follows after time spent, trust is built, friendship is developed and commitment is established.
Lastly, I would recommend to work on not playing any more games for the purpose of control. You both were playing a lot of games and reality is, if either of you were more authentic, it would have been much more peaceful. It’s hard in the dating world. I used to be a master at all the games and very successful with it. My low self esteem and insecurities is what drove me to play those games. Now…since I’ve worked a lot on all my baggage and cleared it, I am so much stronger and much more authentic. If someone is not attracted to me in that form, then that’s okay! I do not need the attention anyways. I am much more peaceful inside to let situations organically play out as they should vs. me playing the games to influence a situation one way or the other.
I understand you have strong feelings for this guy, but I would suggest to let the idea of him go. Already from what you told me, it sounds like there would be A LOT of walls up for him which means a TON of work for you, a ton of drama and constant games. Is that really what you want? If you do, feel free to contact him again in a few months. When you do…TAKE IT SUPER SLOW!!! Don’t give into whatever he wants just so you can keep his attention…be authentic, communicate honestly and respect yourself…which will require him to respect you in return. Then you can just see where it goes from there.
Thank you for letting me know that you felt cared about by me!! That always warms my heart and makes my work here on the forum VERY rewarding!!!!
I would love to hear your thoughts in return!
Heidi
Hi Daysi,
I’m glad to hear you are on board for giving yourself some time to heal. As you do that, it is going to be important that you talk to him about it. It will confuse him if you just pull away and it will probably also hurt him.
You can say something like this, “John….I really like you. I like myself when I am with you. I love our conversations, I love our friendship and I love how safe and happy I feel when you are around. I do imagine that you and I could make a really wonderful couple. That is why I need to pull my energy back for a bit and let myself heal from this divorce. If I keep connecting with you the way I have been, it masks all my hurt from this recent loss. I don’t want to do that to you or to myself. I would still love to stay connected and keep our friendship going, so would you be willing to talk about a new temporary design while I work through things?”
Maybe you guys can agree to meeting up for coffee once or twice a month, but that’s it. The more you connect with each other, the more you will head back into deepening the relationship. Which…at some point, sounds like it would be a great thing! You just need a bit of time.
What do you think about this idea?
Heidi
Hi Kerryn,
My heart hurts for you. Your husband is having a relationship while you are watching. I want to really encourage you to set some boundaries. I know you feel helpless, but you are not helpless. You have given your power away to him by letting him disregard how you are feeling. You say he is an honorable man, which I’m sure he is in many areas of his life, but in this particular situation, he is not honorable. He is not holding to the agreement you both made about having an open relationship. He is cutting you off anytime you want to talk about it and he is claiming that you should let him do what he wants. Do you think that is honorable? You say he cares about how you feel, but I’m not seeing it here. How is he showing you that he cares about you? Essentially, I think he has really built up quite the cozy situation. He gets to have a very devoted wife to create stability for him AND a mistress on the side he gets to just play with. If you agreed to that kind of design and were okay with it, that would be one thing. Instead, you are sitting on the sidelines watching only thinking about how to get him back.
I’m going to say some things that may be a bit challenging to hear. None the less, I just want you to really think about what I am saying and sit with it for a bit.
You have a husband who is not caring about you. He is doing whatever he wants at the expense of you. He is using the money you both create to support a woman he is having an affair with (she is most likely egging him on just to pay her medical bills – I have no doubt she is using him for all he is worth). He is not willing, AT ALL, to get some help about his sexual limitations. He won’t even talk to you about it. You guys decide to open the sexual aspect to other people, yet he is choosing to step outside that agreement and does not care about how it’s affecting you. He loves you and doesn’t want to lose you, but he is still going to have his way and do what he wants.
So I want to invite you to instead of looking at him and focusing on how to get him back to you, look at yourself and what you are CHOOSING to participate in. You are not a victim of this situation. The problem here is, it sounds like every time you try to talk about it, he shuts you down and says, “Leave it.” I’m sorry but Kerryn, that is not okay. A relationship is about 2 people, not just one. Love and care and connection is about 2 people agreeing to work through things, no matter how hard it gets. That is not the situation you are explaining here.
Do you remember the Respect Principle?? You have lost respect for yourself. You don’t believe in the value that you have to offer him, therefore he is not going to believe in your value. First and foremost, you need to connect back to yourself again. You need to get off the sidelines and start to participate in the relationship instead of sitting on the sidelines. And participating does not mean that you don’t get to have your feelings and that you “leave it.” Participating means that you get to feel what you need to feel and that you participate in the design of your marriage. If he is not willing to let you participate, then you have a decision to make and so does he. I imagine he does not feel threatened by losing you because you sit on the sidelines. He gets to do whatever he wants and you just watch. So why wouldn’t he continue? There are no consequences. You have got to find your light, your truth, your value. So what if you are over weight. He can’t get hard. We all have limitations that can be worked with. We are human. SO WHAT!!! You are valuable! You are worth loving and fighting for! If you cannot see that, then it’s time you start. Would you be willing to see a therapist or coach to help you with this? It doesn’t sound like you are ready at the moment to risk losing him and that’s okay. What you CAN do is start to build your self esteem back up and THEN you can work on creating a different design in the relationship.
I wish there were an easy answer here for you, but reality is, your relationship is not in a good place right now. You want him back, but reality is, you are not looking at the foundational problem. Your husband is not willing to get help with his challenges and is not interested in involving you either. So let’s say you do get his attention back. What do you think is going to happen when something else shows up? What is his shop burns to ground? What if it fails? What if he gets cancer? He will react the same exact way as he is now…he will find the shortcuts to relieve himself of his pain, even if it means disregarding you in the process. THAT IS THE FOUNDATIONAL PROBLEM….not that his attention is on another woman. Now granted, I am only hearing your side of the story. You both need to find healthier ways to deal with the limitations you have. You stay silent and sit on the sidelines, he takes shortcuts to happiness (which don’t work long term by the way) and does what he wants. You are being dependent and he is being narcissistic. Its a formula that can work quite well together, until something like this happens. Its times for you to start putting yourself at the top of your priority list instead of at the bottom.
I would love your feedback and thoughts! Stay connected with us!!
Heidi
Hi Ya C,
When you ask for help with something, it usually needs to be about something he is really good at and knows a lot about. You already mentioned to him that you needed to learn how to be more social, so why not continue on with that subject? He used to be a psychologist, so maybe you could meet up and say, “I have this problem. I met this guy and for a few weeks we hit it off really well. Then while we were planning to meet up, our wires got crossed in text and before I knew it, things ended. I re-read the texts and saw where I messed up and want to fix it with him. He is a pretty great guy and I would like to continue getting to know him. What advice can you give me to get his attention back again?”
And listen…you are doing the best you know how. Being human means that we are going along in life and functioning with the information we have available to us…then we mess up, then we learn. Yes, it would have been a good idea to let him help you. You did a great thing by looking up this program and making efforts to learn and be better. That’s all anyone can ever ask for! So you are doing a great job!
You ask how he could so easily disconnect…..there are a lot of reasons why someone can do that. Only he knows. The thing is, you guys were still in such a new phase, that disconnecting is much easier if something goes awry. I do want to warn you to pay attention to that about him though. I know that I personally used to be like that. I could disconnect so easily and move on. It was because I had a lot of walls up, a lot of fear and I was much more emotionally unhealthy. Disconnecting so easily can be a symptom of someone who may have a BIG challenge committing or going very deep. So just keep an eye on that. It’s hard to say if he thought of you as a hook up. My sense is no, as you guys did spend quite a bit of time together. But only time will tell.
Keep us updated!!!
Hi Viola,
Have you heard from him at all or been in contact with him? You are facing a VERY BIG challenge and that is distance. It is sooooo hard to catch his attention with flirting, asking for help, appreciating him when you guys have lives in a different city that is an hour apart.
I would initiate contact sooner than later. The longer you go without connecting to each other, the more you both will get used to the idea of being without each other. What if you texted him and said, “I have something to celebrate and I would love to do that with you! Are you up for a drink this weekend?” Then you can tell him about the flight attendant thing.
Maybe also have a discussion as to what happened that caused him to pull away. If you do it in a way that is with a curious mindset, he may be more comfortable to be honest with you. You can say, “Listen, I really liked you and I together. I want to experience and learn more about you, but you have pulled away for some reason. Did I do something that caused this? I really would like to know. I am interested in learning and being better.” Hopefully he will open up to you. If he doesn’t, then I would caution you anyways. A guy who can not be honest and open about something like that, would make a very difficult partner. Honest communication is CRUCIAL for a relationship to work and last.
I also am wondering if he found someone else. You said you got suspicious. What happened that made you suspicious?
Heidi
Hi Daysi I,
It’s hard having a man as a best friend and not as a lover as well. It’s torture actually. When there is such a strong, natural connection like that, it feels only natural to move into the intimacy realm.
I want to say to just give it some time. Has he ever expressed feelings for you romantically or sexually?
You feel rejected because you are putting your energy out there and he is not responding. Would you consider giving it a break for a bit? You are going through a divorce and that means you need some time to heal, but you are not really allowing yourself that right now. You keep re-wounding yourself by continually putting yourself into a situation of feeling rejected. How about you pull your energy back in, let go of the idea of him for right now and focus on yourself….maybe start with a few months and see how you feel.
I recommend this because a lot of times, after a breakup, we end up having strong feelings for someone because we are in the middle of hurting and it feels waaaay better to like someone than to fully and completely deal with and feel the loss of love. I’m not suggesting at all that your feelings for him are not real for now….I am just suggesting to give yourself some breathing room to feel the loss of your last mate. If you do end up moving forward with this other guy, you will be so much healthier and much more emotionally ready for him.
I strongly feel that if you were to get involved with this guy right now…you might end up running into some challenges because you did not allow yourself some healing time. Does this make sense?
Besides, building that friendship is one of the most valuable things you could do!!! Its crucial for having a long lasting love together, so why not just spend time developing that, appreciating him and learning about each other in a platonic way?
Heidi
Hi Ya C,
Your conversation was fascinating! The main problem I can see is that you both were not on the same page, but the texting really messed it up. You both somehow got triggered and being an objective reader, I saw BOTH of you react to something that wasn’t really necessary as it was being misread. You guys totally missed each other…you were both on the same exact page and that page was “I want to see you.” It was quite simple in that he was very busy and had little time but you offered to see him out vs. at his home, which is what he wanted because that is all he had time for. He expressed it very clearly in his 2nd text. It sounds like going out all the time was draining for him. He needed to have some quiet, homebody time…which is not what you were offering…THIS IS WHY TALKING is so important. Next time, when you feel him reacting to what you said….IMMEDIATELY stop the texting and call him and clear it up. People mis-communicate all the time over text and that is exactly what happened here!
As he said, he has continued to date, but it still sounds like he has a bit of interest. At this point, I would not wait as your relationship was super new and you had very little time to bond, so it is easier for him to detach and replace you. Ask for help sooner than later. You need to see each other in person!!! When you do see him, suggest another meetup AT HOME!! Tell him you will make him dinner and then you guys can sit on the couch and watch a movie or play a game or….
Does this help?
Heidi
Hi Karen,
This is so hard! It sounds like you guys had a great connection and he was ready to move forward with you!!! Is there anything you are willing to do in order to improve your snapping at him? It is an unhealthy way to communicate and I know you know this….so why not work on it?
I would say that is the best chance you have at getting him back. He is very clear that he is not interested in that kind of communication. So reality is, it doesn’t matter what you do, if you do not change how you express your more intense emotions, it will never work.
So…it is a lost cause if you are not willing to work on it and heal that part of yourself that is sabotaging connection. If you ARE willing to work on it, it will take some time, but usually people will have more patience as long as they see improvement.
Are you willing?
Heidi
Hi Kerryn,
Wow! This is quite the layered situation. I am so sorry you are going through all of this. The first thing I want to tell you is to NOT take full responsibility for this. I am sensing you are blaming yourself quite a bit for this happening. You have quite the caring and compassionate heart! First and foremost, HE IS RESOPNSIBLE for his own happiness. If he is feeling helpless, powerless and not enough like a man…it is his job to work through that and you are there to support and help. Has he talked with you about this? Has he asked for your help with this? If he wants to buy a donut king shop and be unhappy, then that’s okay! For a man, IT IS CRUCIAL that he has something to create and produce, so even if this donut king makes him unhappy eventually, for now it is helping and giving him purpose. Do not worry about the future until it shows up. Worrying about something that hasn’t happened costs a lot of your energy! For now, support his choices.
I also want to ask you where you fit into this situation? Everything you are talking about is HIS unhappiness. I am wondering where YOU fit into all of this. If he needs a feeble, small, needy woman to make him feel like a hero, then he has some soul searching to do. Reality is, she may make him feel like a boy and a hero in this moment, but if he were to go over there and live with her….eventually at some point ALL OF THAT would disappear and he would lose respect for her and start to feel resentful. I am guessing that when he found you and chose to be with you, his life was much more in order. He had a job, a purpose, felt like he could provide. So when his life is better, he wants a stronger, stable woman. When his life is in the dumps, he wants a needy woman. He is living in a serious illusion to think that this other woman is something special in his life. I know it feels like it to him, but I would bet a million bucks he would get sick of her real quick if he were to ever live with her day in and day out. So basically, his higher self esteem chose you and his lower self esteem is choosing her. So what do you do about that? The LAST thing I would ever suggest is to become more needy. It’s great that you are doing little things here and there to activate his hero instinct, BUT DO NOT LOSE WHO YOU ARE in this process just so he chooses you and not her. That would be the biggest loss of all. You maintain your strength, your self esteem, your stability!! Do not become smaller in any way to accommodate him. He needs to step up and find himself again. And it sounds like with this new job, he is on his way.
Have you guys considered a sex therapist? They can have some AMAZING ideas and insights into what is happening. He may have some hormonal imbalances like being very low on testosterone. He might need to exercise more. It might be purely psychological (not feeling like a man) of which can be corrected. My question to you is….is he willing to fight for your marriage? Does he care about how his choices are affecting you? Do you guys have an agreement about your open sex life? It is CRUCIAL that you protect your relationship FIRST!!! Couples that open themselves up to other sexual partners usually have some very clear and agreed upon boundaries they abide by. Communication needs to be very high and most of all, they choose each other over other people if either person starts to feel uncomfortable. So that is why I ask you….where do you fit into all of this? Where is he caring about how this is affecting you?
Heidi
Hi Mel!
So great to hear from you!!! Thank you for the update!
Of course you feel lost! That is very normal and to be expected. When there is a BIG HOLE that shows up in our lives, be it a person leaves, a job is lost something major happens that changes our lives, feeling lost is part of the process of recovery. There is a period of time where there are no answers, there is no direction, we feel like we are floating and not grounded….we feel lost. And that is OKAY!!!! It’s important to be okay feeling lost for awhile. If you can learn to be comfortable in the uncomfortable, learn to be patient in the unknown, then you will find more peace. New answers, new people, new events will show up. They always do. It just takes a bit of time. And it will all show up exactly when it is supposed to. Have faith in that! In the meantime, it’s okay to be lost and directionless and be in the unknown! Rest easy and know that you can breathe better than before and there is a peace that you are experiencing that is so important for you!!!
Heidi
Hi Joy,
Well, you can just be very upfront and set a boundary. Here is the reality of his life. He has no time. You want him to make time where he has none. If he hangs out with you, that means he has to say no to something else.
I imagine that once he texts you to come visit him, you do it. So you are not really giving him any reason to make plans otherwise. He gets to see you whenever he asks. Why not set a little boundary? Let him know that you love seeing him but you are just not sure when you can stop by again. If he would like to see you outside of the shop, you would love that and can make time for him.
See what he does with that….it will put just a little pressure on him.
Heidi
Hi Joy!
It sounds like his mixed signals of getting close then disappearing is his fear running his life. It sounds like you guys have a great connection. It is going to take a lot of time probably for him to realize you are not his ex. You can tell him that all you want, but he will never believe it until he starts to see it in action and FEELS the difference. If you really want him, then you probably need to turn up your patience dial. He is sooooo busy and starting a new business is a whole different experience for a man than it is for a woman typically. They experience everything differently and my guess is…he is going to need A LOT more time to before he starts to involve you in his personal life.
The “hero” type of questions you can ask him for can be super simple. Maybe say, “Hey, my girlfriends and I are looking for a new sushi place to go to tonight. Any recommendations?” Maybe ask him for some advice about your kids….something simple. Maybe ask for help with recipes or organizing something. You can be independent AND ask questions for his ideas and advice for simple things right now.
Do you ever workout? Does he workout? Maybe you guys can find a common activity that is important to build into life on top of work and kids and you do that activity together….like exercising.
Have you ever tried becoming less available for him? Maybe you pull away for a few weeks and let him make all of the effort. If he misses you because he doesn’t get to see you at his shop…it may inspire him to invite you somewhere.
Hopefully this gives you more ideas! Keep us updated!
Hi Stephanie,
I am so sorry to hear this. You are doing everything you possibly know how. He said that “he just doesn’t know because he is so hurt.” What does that mean? Is there some big event that happened between you two or lots of stuff has just built up over the years?
I am also wondering if something from the military is causing him to shut down. He sounds like he is still connecting but doesn’t feel safe enough to move forward with you. I’m sad he only gave 1 try with a therapist. It sounds like he is just making excuses to not really work on anything.
I hate to say this, but all you can do….ever….is the best you know how….and unfortunately that sometimes is not enough. Because relationships take 2 people, 1 person can do ALL the work, but the other person needs to join in that process for healing to occur. So will all of your efforts pay off? Well, it depends on how you want to look at it. If you are reading and learning all of these things only to get your husband back, then maybe it will pay off or maybe it won’t. That is up to him. HOWEVER, if you are becoming a better wife, a better person and learning a lot and changing and growing…the ABSOLUTELY all of your efforts are paying off! You are becoming more that what you were and bottom line, that is the best thing you can do for yourself. He doesn’t seem to be interested in joining you on this process, so all you can do is keep growing and working on yourself. Keep developing new patterns with him. If trust was broken, when he sees that over time, all this new behavior is truly who you are vs. a temporary fix to win him back, then he may feel safe to re-connect. Keep giving it as much time as possible. The people you are learning from are EXCELLENT! You may also like the Gottman Institute. Dr. John Gottman did the largest study, to this very day, asking the question “What makes it last?” The study was over 20 years and the data he collected was incredible. I LOVE all the advice he offers for couples. Spot on and powerful!!! Maybe instead of doing a therapist, your husband would be willing to do a weekend workshop or even go through a book together with you. That may seem more do-able for him.
Again, you are doing a great job and the best you know how and that’s all you can really ask for from anyone! If he still chooses to walk away, then at least you will have peace inside that you did everything you know how and you can be proud of that. He will not be able to say the same thing, which is sad.
For now, just keep building your friendship. Maybe take a break from talking about how to get back together. Develop the friendship more, create new patterns with him, practice all that you are learning and mostly….LET GO OF THE OUTCOME! Pay more attention to the process and bonding with him. That’s all that matters…whatever is happening NOW is where your attention needs to stay. Take the pressure off of him and give him some breathing room for a bit and just practice being together. Then when you sense it’s okay, approach the topic again of maybe trying a workshop or a book.
We would love your feedback and any other thoughts you have. Keep us updated and ask all the questions you need! We are here to help you through this!
Heidi
Hi Viola,
How long were you guys together for? Are you aware of anything that happened that would cause him to pull away? Has he always lived an hour away from you?
Usually when someone says, “It’s me, not you” it means there is something about the relationship that just didn’t work OR there is something that happened like maybe he found someone else or maybe something traumatic happened (like losing a job or family issues). That’s why I am asking if there was an event like an argument or something that happened between you guys that could have triggered him to pull away from you?
It is hard to offer guidance for you. We can tell you all the things to say and do, but sometimes, if there is a deeper issue (especially if he will not share it with you), no matter what you do, it will not matter. It may be time for you to let him go. A little more information will be helpful.
Have you read “His Secret Obsession” and “What Men Really Want?” There are some great tips of how to catch a man’s attention again. Go back and review some of those and then come back here and ask any questions!
I do have a question for you….why do you want him back? What is it about him that makes you want to fight for him to be in your life?
Heidi
Hi Jackie!
I am so glad you got some clarification. I am also sad that he chose to stay with a controlling woman. He sure is missing out on life! I am really proud of you that you set a boundary, even though it meant losing him. That is so hard to do when there is such a strong connection. Well done!
As far as meeting people, I always suggest to find groups that you can join that do activities that you love. That way, you will be having fun, laughing and being social which means you will be putting off a good vibe which is attractive. What about dancing…square dancing, line dancing, ballroom dancing? An exercise group? Maybe volunteer for a cause you support? Have you looked at meetup.com. It’s a website where people post their groups. So you would join and type in “hiking” and a ton of hiking groups will show up and you can choose which ones you want to try. There are groups for everything under the sun on that website. It’s great!
Keep us updated on anything you find that interests you!
Heidi
