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Hi Maxi,
So I’m still not clear on your situation. Are you saying you are still living at home with your husband due to medical issues? I’m still a little confused as to how this guy you are not wanting to lose in your life, fits into your married life.
The question is not whether or not he loves you. It’s more about whether he is willing to experience that love. Love is never enough to keep a relationship going. Many people break up, not because they don’t love each other, but because there are challenges with how they connect. This guy seems like he isn’t quite sure how he wants to be with you. He comes close and then pulls away and that typically is a sign of fear. The thing is, are you even able to be in a relationship with him being that you are married? I’m not sure how invested this guy is, if he is still going out and meeting up with other women. So again, I’m not sure what you want from him. Do you want 100% commitment and to be in a committed relationship with him?
I get there are things you need to talk to him about that are bothering you. How about you tell us what you would want to say to him. What are you hoping to happen by talking to him about these things?
Heidi
Hi Anna,
You are asking some really great questions!
I LOVE your awareness about yourself and how you are able to acknowledge that you are strongly connecting to a fantasy. The way to keep things “real” is to keep reminding yourself he is human and has a lot of flaws. I know you don’t know what his flaws are quite yet, but in time they will expose themselves. How is the connection between you guys? How frequently are you talking? It doesn’t sound like he has set anything up yet to see you in person. Is he initiating contact with you at all? I personally would not disclose your more personal information until it’s necessary. You guys haven’t even been on a date yet, so I’m not sure how invested this guy really is. If he finally starts to show some real interest and making more effort to see you and connect with you, then you can talk to him about the autism and addiction patterns. At this point, I think saying anything about that would scare him away. Ultimately though, it’s up to you how you want to handle it. I would suggest though, that when you do share this part of you, you want to do it in person so you guys can have an actual conversation about it.
As far as your feelings towards him being “normal” or part of your autism response, it doesn’t really matter where it’s coming from. All that matters is that you stay connected to yourself and honor your needs and staying grounded more in reality than fantasy. The more you can get grounded in reality, it will help balance out the obsessive energy you feel about him. I wouldn’t call your feelings “co-dependent.” At least from what you have explained. Co-dependence is meeting another person’s needs at the expense of your own. I don’t see that happening, but if that is a pattern you have, then it would be a good thing to pay attention to and really watch yourself.
As far as your other friend goes, it’s really wonderful that he already knows everything about you. Do you have any romantic feelings towards him? Have you been out on any dates with him? I know you don’t quite feel the passion and sexual tension with him, as all that is focused on Ricky. But do you have any romantic thoughts/feelings towards this guy?
Heidi
Hi Maxi,
Welcome to the forum! This sounds like quite a difficult situation. Let’s make sure I am understanding correctly.
You are married and have been having an affair for 10 years with this other guy. This other guy is now connecting to a woman you don’t like. Is this accurate?
It’s definitely difficult dealing with another culture. It sounds like he takes a lot of things personally. So what are you wanting from him now? Are you wanting him to dump this other girl and just focus 100% on you? It sounds like you want a full on relationship with him, but I’m wondering what you would do about your marriage.
Heidi
Let’s talk about your anxiety a little more. I can see how this energy would contribute to him taking some space. Is this anxiety something you are willing to face and deal with? It’s a lot of pressure you are putting on him to be your EVERYTHING. Imagine not “needing” him to help you feel safe in your life. Imagine feeling perfectly okay that you can source yourself, no matter what happens. Your fear of having no one except for him is something you deeply want to look at. If he were not in your life, how do you think you would cope? Do you feel like you can take care of yourself? I know he makes you feel safer in the sense that you at least have someone around, but what if you created that own safety in yourself?
Yes, not texting him and letting him come to you is part of what giving space means. It’s hard though because you guys haven’t really talked about what that means to him, so it’s a guessing game at this point. I would say you are doing a great job not initiating as much. I wouldn’t worry about him feeling like you no longer think about him. He is off in his own little world right now. So why not have that conversation with him about EXACTLY what he needs. You can say something like “I know you want your space and I feel like I am giving that to you by not texting all of the time. It’s hard because I so deeply care about you and love being connected with you. I just want to know if you feel supported by me. Am I giving you the space you need? I’m a little lost because I’m not exactly sure what makes you feel like you have the space you need. Teach me what it means for you to have space?”
Thoughts?
Heidi
Wow! That’s quite the update!
So you both agreed you didn’t want the FWB kinda thing. It sounds like he deeply cares about you though.
How was the sex? Was it passionate? Could you feel his attraction to you maybe? I know he doesn’t want to ruin the friendship, but I”m also wondering if he DOES have a bit of a romantic attraction towards you. That’s why I’m wondering about how the sex was. If you were guys were strictly platonic and there were no romantic feelings, I wonder why he had sex with you again. Did you happen to tell him how you feel about him? I know you agreed to no FWB together, but I”m wondering if you were honest at all about how you do feel him.
Yes, there are MANY examples of the best marriages originating from friendship. This could very well be the case for you guys. Who knows what will happen. All that matters is that you keep being yourself and whether it’s Tim or some other gentleman, they will love you and value you just as you are.
It’s good that you cleared things up with Dave. Have you thought about dating other people? You may not have the time or energy at this point, but maybe consider putting yourself out there a little more. This actually might give Tim a wake up call.
Heidi
Hi Marina,
Welcome to the forum. Thank you for reaching out to us and sharing your challenges.
Let’s start with talking about your “neediness” and making him feel suffocated. Is this a typical pattern you have? Do you have a tendency to easily get jealous?
First, let me validate for you that what you are feeling, I imagine most women would feel insecure if their guy was typically only hanging out with exes and other girls. There is something a bit fishy about that. I understand your concerns.
The thing is, he is not going to change. So if you want him back in your life, that means that he will continue to go hang out with his “friends.” Is this something you are able to accept about him? The thing you DON”T want to do is to try and change him again. You spent a lot of energy suffocating him and being needy. If you invite him back into your life, you would need to figure out a different way to deal with his choices that you don’t like.
Thoughts?
Heidi
Hey there,
Thank you for sharing more details. I really want to commend you for owning your part in the creation of all of this. It takes a lot of courage to acknowledge and be in relationship with your limitations. Well done!
I can see why you would think that your words were hurtful. The truth is, that is just PART of the equation. His part is choosing to hold onto those words and putting meaning behind them and not choosing to forgive. Yes, you were hurtful. It’s part of relationship. He was hurtful as well. His choice to not have children without talking to you was really hurtful. So all in all, you BOTH created the situation you are in, so like Spyce has already talked about, be careful in taking too much responsibility for this.
Help us understand where you are at. You said your bitterness is leaving, which sounds like you still have some bitterness. Despite what your mind says that you need to let this go and you want to fight for him, it sounds like there is still some energy blocking you from having a full, open heart to him. Yes? No?
Let’s talk more about your anxiety. Have you had this whole life? Anxiety is fear about the future and it causes someone to not feel safe in life and it increases the need for control. Why do you think you respond to life this way?
I know you want to “make up” for your shortcomings, but there is NOTHING to make up for. What needs to happen is you forgiving yourself and stepping into love and acceptance for who you are…even your shadow side. It’s your humanness, right? So coming into acceptance of yourself, forgiving yourself and loving yourself will then help you open your heart even more to him and he will start to experience you differently. You cannot control his response to life, but you can control yours. In order for him to feel safe to come back, he needs to see you handling your life differently. He is not going to want to walk back into the same old patterns. He needs something to change and that is where you have the most power. When you shift, how you both interact with each other shifts and then gives him the opportunity to either want to rejoin with you or decide it’s not what he wants to experience.
So the best way to show him you’re worth another chance, is to actually BELIEVE you are, in the depths of your cells. If you are judging yourself for how you have behaved and if you are holding onto any bitterness or hurt and not fully forgiving him for his choices, those act as blocks to intimacy and connection. Make sense?
So let’s talk about those things more. What are you thoughts about this approach?
Heidi
Thank you for sharing more.
No techniques work with narcissists in the sense that the techniques will never change him. Being in a relationship with a narcissist that is not willing to look at themselves and take responsibility, means you end up living for them and putting your own needs aside. It’s not really a relationship, it’s more about managing the situation. Have you studied narcissism much? Do you feel you have a lot of knowledge about how they function?
Since you have been to 5 different counselors and he still is not willing to shift, work on the relationship or himself, I’m wondering what is keeping you with him. He is a sex addict as well, so he will continue to cheat, especially since you are not able to be sexually active with him. It sounds like this guy is pretty steeped in his patterns and is really okay living his life the way he is. Techniques don’t work on someone who isn’t willing to shift/change/connect/grow.
You are obviously not happy and on top of that dealing with some intense physical challenges. You want to have your needs met, but you are looking in the wrong direction. From how you describe him, he is not really an option. So what can you do to get your needs met yourself? What can you do to help you become more happy in your life? I’m guessing you are not ready to disconnect from him, so if you are going to choose to stay, how about focusing on yourself. WOuld you consider a therapist just for yourself?
Heidi
Hey there!
I’m getting caught up on everything that’s been going on in your situation. It’s so incredibly difficult, especially for women, to deal with being disconnected from. Like you said, you’ve been together for so long and this is a brand new type of situation. Learning how to navigate it can be tricky, so we are glad you are here getting some ideas.
I’m curious, have you guys talked at all about what “space” means to him? Have you asked him what he imagines that looks like and feels like? You want to make sure you both are on the same page. What you need to pay most attention to in yourself, is to not OVERdo the techniques and love and appreciate. He needs space, so the more you are telling him you love him, appreciate him, need him it can trigger him pulling away a bit because he will feel your “need” for him to come back. It sounds like he is still being quite responsive, so I think the best thing you can do right now is to focus on building your friendship together and not necessarily the love/romantic side of it. If you build the friendship, it can create safety, it can support becoming closer as friends and it can help him not feel any pressure from you. There is still so much to learn about each other, so use that to generate conversations with him. But you want to keep it light, fun and pleasurable. Imagine you are dating for the first time again. What kinds of questions can you ask him? What kinds of things would you want to know about him?
Does this make sense?In order for you to find some peace in yourself and focus on just building the friendship while he is taking his “space,” you need to identify your insecurities and who you are separate than him. This is really good for you, although not very fun. It will help you become a much better partner. Have you figured out what makes you happy? I really like the movie Runaway Bride. She has to go through getting to know herself. I know it’s not your type of situation, but it’s still the concept of learning who she is separate than her partner.
I would stay away from triggering his hero instinct, just for now. He needs to feel like he is getting the space he needs before he will be inspired to help you with something. He will also know that you are probably asking for help just to re-connect and will feel that manipulative energy…most likely he will not respond very well to that. You can say I love you, but you might want to say “I support you needing your space and I understand. You not being here is really helping me see how much I really love you. I know that may not be what you are feeling right now and that’s okay. I just wanted to tell you. Have a good night.” Saying it in this manner is about you saying it to him with more meaning than just an “I love you.” When you say that, he will also feel pressure like he needs to say it back, because I’m sure you guys have exchanged many “I love yous” over the years. So again, you want him to feel like there is no pressure. He is in his “cave” energy and needs to be there for a bit. The more you enter into his cave, the longer he will stay there.
And while he is in his cave energy, it’s a GREAT time for you to work on yourself as well. What kinds of things did you do really well in the relationship? What kinds of things did you not do well? And why? How can you work on those aspects in yourself?
Thoughts?
Heidi
Great to hear from you again.
Why is your love life the way it is and not the rest of your life? I’ve seen it a million times…VERY high functioning, successful people who excel at work, health, money etc., but their love lives are a mess! The other categories you have control over….love you don’t. It’s not a risk of breaking your heart to get an MBA. It’s a black and white kind of process. Love on the other hand, you have no control other, involves another person and involves your heart on the deepest level. Love will trigger things in you that nothing else can. We all desire to love. Parents/role models/ siblines and life can really mess it up though. Bottom line is, love is a risk and will expose every great thing about you and the very worst about you. That’s why I’ve studied it so much. I had such a horrible childhood and dating was the one way that I could tell how messed I was…I excelled in all areas of my life. I was very high functioning and no on in a million years, would ever have known what I was surviving at home….I didn’t even know the extent to what was happening, but when I dated and had boyfriends….man! I could see all kind of my blocks, fears, anger, resentment etc. It’s an emotion that touches every aspect of you, so again…it brings out your very best and your very worst and you have no control over that. Getting an MBA does not do that. Does this make sense?
I think I went so far outside of my personal values I feel judged by him. I’m curious…what makes you feel judged by him?
So I’m going to be straightforward here. Saying anything to this effect Maybe I do want him to realize that what control I gave was rare if not extinct and continue a relationship. If not I will be okay he isn’t the only fish but he is a really great one on many levels. is just you trying to feel better about yourself. The truth is, he is not THAT invested to really care. By talking about these VERY vulnerable things with a guy who isn’t your match right now, is more about you trying to control his story about you. There is no way that you could feel judged by him unless you were judging yourself. So I want to invite you to look at the judgment you have towards yourself instead of trying to fix it by explaining things to him. You guys are not in the kind of established relationship to where you would have these kinds of discussions.
Being open and vulnerable is NOT always a good thing. The guideline I like to offer is to think about who you are being vulnerable with. Do you have that kind of relationship where you BOTH are open and vulnerable with each other? Are they a safe person to be vulnerable with? Are they the kind of person that will be supportive, validating and caring about your experiences and feelings? If not, then it’s not a good idea to be open and vulnerable. All you end up doing is opening yourself up to more rejection and hurt and that’s not what you want. Your vulnerability is sacred and deserves to be shared ONLY with those people who have earned that right. Thoughts on this?
You want to create closure with this guy. Help us understand what you want. Do you want to completely disconnect? Are you wanting a friends with benefits kind of thing? Are you wanting to see where he is at with you?
Heidi
Hi Anna,
Great question! First, I’m wondering why you think it will be an issue very soon. Ricky hasn’t even graduated to seeing you in person yet. He is a VERY slow mover, so what makes you think that he will want to have sex soon. Have things progressed? Has he mentioned that?
The ONLY thing you need to pay attention to is yourself. At this point, it doesn’t sound like you have enough information about either of them to know what direction you are heading with each of them. So the question is more about what YOU want. Everyone is different when it comes to intimacy, so what are your thoughts and needs personally? Do you want to wait until you are in a committed relationship? Or are you okay having sex and not taking it too seriously?
You said your friend is interested but you aren’t sure how you feel about him. Until you ARE sure, I would suggest keeping sex and intimacy out of the picture until you are clear about what you both want to create with each other.
Thoughts?
Heidi
Hi Sarah,
I truly am so sorry that you are going through all of this. Do you see an end to this illness? Are you figuring out ways to heal?
I know you are wanting to do everything you can to get your husband to connect with you. These concepts can help, but they won’t heal the heart. Like Spyce said, it sounds like he is resentful. He has a lot of his needs to being met as well and instead of having integrity, he is choosing to be angry. He probably feels stuck and overwhelmed and with you needing a lot of help to care for yourself and your children, he is getting his needs met the quickest and easiest way possible.
What did your relationship use to be like? You said he has cheated before. Has he ever been faithful? Has he ever been present and connective with you or did his cheating behavior begin when you got sick. How long have you been sick?
I would say that at this point, the techniques are not going to have that much effect. When you are dealing with someone as angry and resentful as him, the techniques will fall onto deaf ears. If he is not even willing to talk to you, there is not much room for growth.
Have you ever worked with a therapist? Is that something you might consider for yourself? I”m curious, has it ever been suggested to break up?
Heidi
Hi Kimberly,
What’s a joke?
Is there a reason you are here? Is there anything we can help with?
Heidi
Hi Robyn,
Wow! What a whirlwind!!! It’s so confusing and frustrating, isn’t it? To be told something one day and then have him so easily disconnect, which invalidates all he said to you….it hurts!
I’m so sorry to say this, but to be blunt…RUN the other way! This guy attaches sooooo easily. He did it with you and now he is doing it with this other woman. From his actions so far, he sounds like a guy who just has no tolerance for being alone. He went from a 4 year “stagnant” relationship straight to you, to now a new woman he is moving to be closer to. YIKES!!! This guy has no clue who he is or what he wants. He just will keep looking for a woman to “source” his self-esteem and make him feel better about who he is. People that do this are pretty empty on the inside. This kind of person is NOT someone you want to be in a relationship with. It would be full of drama, it would eventually feel very draining and you would end up more frustrated and confused than feeling stability and a deep connection. Bewitched or not, doesn’t matter. If he was bewitched, that just means he is vulnerable enough to have that happen to him and isn’t a good match for you anyway…if he wasn’t, then it also validates he is not a good match for you.
No matter the reasons, you have enough information to know that he is someone who is not reliable. You cannot trust his words and he is showing that to you. That’s enough to know he is not someone you can build a strong, stable relationship with as he does not have a lot of integrity with his feelings/words.
Do you REALLY want to step into an experience like this? Do you want to get him back?
Heidi
