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You have high integrity Rhonda. You do what you say you are going to do and that is a great quality about you. You have been through sooooo much with all your jobs! I really hope that whatever you choose next will actually make you happy. It has to be really hard for you to be in a constant struggle for one reason or another over the past several years. I just want to encourage you to maybe look at this pattern and see how you can do things differently…hopefully starting in November.
That little town sounds amazing! What was your favorite part? The history in Europe is so incredible. It sounds like it was a lovely day. Did you end up seeing a lot of seals? Were they out and about? I’d love to see some pics if you feel like sharing!
Why don’t you and Aleks connect over zoom?
Heidi
Thank you for sharing more of your story. You sure have been through a lot. I am so sorry you are having to deal with this. There are several things to work through here. Let’s see if we can help you have a little more clarity.
As one person told me, I’m always helping and giving of myself but I never take and this can affect my friendships/relationships. Is this true? Yes, this is true. Here is a way that may help you understand. People LOVE to help each other. We are not designed to do life alone. So when someone asks you to help them, doesn’t it make you feel good to get to help? It’s bonding, it makes you feel good, it makes you feel wanted and needed, it creates memories and it helps you get to know the person more. So when you don’t ask or accept help, you stunt the relationship. You take all of these precious moments that are meant for bonding and growing together and you put a wall up. When you say no, it doesn’t allow anyone to really get to know you. So people will always feel on the outside of your life and never really get to know the real you…and perhaps that is why you do it. If you keep people out, they will never see the inside of you, which is maybe what you are most afraid of. It’s like I don’t want people to see what happened when they thought so highly of my ex earlier in the relationship and became friends with him as well. You are making this about protecting your ex, but would you be willing to look a little deeper and see how you are trying to actually protect yourself from being raw and vulnerable? What would happen if you said yes to this help of cleaning up the mess? You already know what happens when you say no. You go to the bar and try to escape your feelings by drinking and then you scare your friends and put yourself in danger – and call a brand new guy you are trying to get to know. You somehow think it’s going to be worse than that if you actually say yes to having some help with this?? It’s incredibly intimate and vulnerable to say yes to your friend who offered help. Maybe find out that it’s okay to be that with someone. And honestly, having a guy friend help you can be a really great thing. They go through life very differently and experience relationships differently. Don’t determine ahead of time, what his experience is going to be. You have no clue what he would respond like. I imagine he would be quite efficient and protective of you. Wouldn’t that feel great??? The thing about saying yes to help is, you are terrified and the only way through your fears is to step into them and find out you are okay. You have already been through an INCREDIBLE amount in your life. If you can survive all of that and move forward, saying “yes” to help is easy!!! You are stronger than you give yourself credit for!
I just want to touch on the cheating thing. It seems that you don’t quite have the skillset to know how to be discerning with who you enter into a relationship with. This is, in part, because of the amount of low self esteem that you carry. It doesn’t sound like you have standards as to how you are treated and what you expect in a relationship. Here is a little homework you can start on. It’s going to take a while and evolve over time, but it’s important for you to start the process. I call it the non-negotiable list. It’s a list of qualities you HAVE to have in a relationship in order to feel nourished…NO EXCEPTIONS. This means, the qualities on this list, if they are not present, the relationship WILL NOT work for you. This is why it takes time to create this list because most people are not really aware and they choose a partner based on how they feel vs. how the relationship functions.
Here are a few things on my list:
1. Romantic
2. Animal lover
3. Loves nature
4. High emotional intelligence
5. Financially abundant
6. Strong communicator
7. ActiveI tell people to start by making a list of everything they want in a guy. Think in terms of categories like finances, family, health, travel, children etc. Then circle the most important qualities in each category and make a new list. Then really think and feel into each quality and see if it’s a quality you could compromise on…or not. The qualities I listed above are solid and set in stone. These qualities are what I need to have in my own life in order to maintain my personal balance. If a guy goes against these or doesn’t join me with them, then we are not like-minded enough to have a deep, nourishing, growing relationship. The non-negotiable list functions as your standards. It guides you in what to look for in a partner.
One thing I will say. The most important thing to know is that you ALWAYS want to know who they are in their worst BEFORE you really go head first into any relationship. Who a person is in their worst, is what will make or break the relationship. It doesn’t matter how amazing the guy is, if he is not respectful and honorable in his worst moments, the relationship will never last. You already have been through abuse and addiction. Those are obviously things you never want to experience again, so making sure you pay attention to those signs early on is important for you. You want to see how they treat you, themselves and others in their most stressful times, so you can see the worst in them and know that you are safe physically and emotionally. And, of course, any standard you have for them, you expect of yourself as well. So if there is something you need from a guy and you don’t offer that yourself, then it tells you some areas you need to work on.
Lastly, I’m going to touch on this lightly, but we need to keep talking about it. Trust is not actually about anyone else. People tend to feel like the other person needs to earn trust, but the truth is, we are all human and will break that trust when we mess up. So trust in others is a relative thing. The trust I like to help my clients develop that is UNSHAKEABLE is trust within themselves. If you don’t trust yourself, you sure as heck can never trust anyone or anything else in your life. Trusting yourself means “I trust that no matter what “you” do or choose or behave like, I will be okay. I trust I am resilient. I trust I am strong. I trust I am resourceful. So even if you cheat on me, lie to me, hurt me…I trust I will be okay and figure out how to heal and get back up.” That kind of trust in yourself allows you to feel safe in your life, because people will break the external trust and when that broken, you will have your inner trust to get you through those challenging moments. Does this make sense?
I know I’ve said a lot, so let’s keep talking.
Heidi
So good to hear from you. I love that you did that! Gosh, we could all use an experience like that right now. It sounds restorative. I’m happy to hear that you feel like you are moving on. Thank you for being here and sharing your story and being so wonderful! I love that I got to be part of your journey.
Take care! We are here whenever you need us!
Lots of love coming your way! Heidi
Wow. I love that you are connecting with this and really slowing down your thinking about bringing him back into your life.
He is incredibly fragile and insecure and it shows up by be incredibly controlling. So what do you think was happening for you, that you chose his needs and demands over your need to connect with your family? It obviously didn’t make you feel good and you are angry about it, so why do you think you make him the priority?
You feel EVERYTHING that is coming up and give it space and time. You journal. You talk about it. You honor ALL your feelings and really look at what they are about. It’s time for you to really start to explore yourself on a deeper level.
You are angry. How come? Where is it coming from? Have you felt this kind of anger before? Are you angry at yourself at all? Are you willing to forgive and let go?
Like I previously said…he gets to be whoever he wants to be. He gets to demand for that attention. He gets to trash talk you. He gets to break up without talking to you about it. THIS IS WHO HE IS and he deserves to be loved and accepted for exactly who he is. We all do. He clearly has a lot of limitations that are quite damaging, but you also are the one who has chosen him and chosen to co-create this design of “love.”
Of course, there are amazing things about you guys as well and that’s always the hardest part to let go of. You just have to keep remembering the parts that don’t work as well and keep the FULL picture in your mind and heart…not just the best parts. The best parts will always make you want to keep holding on and completely negate the worst parts that are actually damaging. Breakups are a rollercoaster ride and the best way to get through them and back into emotional stability is to really work with your emotions, your patterns, your choices, your stories about him and you and love and honor every little thing that comes up and just create space for all of it. This might even be a good time to work with a therapist or coach. You have a lot of stuff you are feeling and carrying around, so why not get a specialist to help you learn how to navigate this period of time in a healthy way. Working with someone will help you develop new ways to handle stress for the rest of your life. It’s worth the time and investment if you are willing.
Heidi
Hi Connie,
I’m a little confused. I responded to your other post and it’s a completely different question and scenario than this post. So let’s keep everything in one spot on this thread. I asked you some questions on the other thread, so go ahead and respond to those here.
I’m not sure which issue you would like to deal with. Maybe it’s all the same issue? From this story, it doesn’t sound like there is an issue with cheating. So help me understand the whole picture between the 2 posts a little better, so I can get more clarity as to how to best guide you.
As far as this situation, men are highly misunderstood when it comes to not being attracted to an independent woman. Most men that I know LOVE an independent woman. Of course, there are men out there who don’t, but regardless, you have to be you and if a guy is not inspired by that, then he is not the right match for you.
When it comes to being independent AND making a guy feel needed, it’s really simple actually. “Needing” a guy is more about accepting him in your life as a “helper.” Some simple examples might be if he grabs groceries from my car to help, I accept. If he wants to give me a foot massage, I accept. If he wants to cook me dinner, I accept. If there is something he could help me with (even though I could do it myself) I ask him. As independent women, we are very resourceful and figure out how to do anything that we need. When a guy comes into the picture, he can become a main resource to help make life a little easier. So it makes them feel “needed” by being a main resource in our lives, even though we can do things ourselves. It’s REALLY important to feel needed in a relationship…in both directions. So you don’t need to lose or change your independence. It’s just asking for more help from a guy with things he is able to help with, even if you can do them on your own. Does this make sense?
Heidi
Were you able to talk to Aleks yet? If yes, did you guys have a great talk? Tell me about it!
Wow! What in the world do they need your marriage/divorce certificate for? Gosh, it really is crazy what you have had to go through just to work there. And the company sure as heck is not helping at all. I understand you want to take the first job you find back home. I just want to slow you down a bit. Ever since I have known you, every new job you have taken, came from a place of desperately wanting to get out of the current job. And then you end up in another job that you desperately want to get out of. So it’s been a good 3-4 years of you not wanting to be where you are at and being miserable for one reason or another. How about doing it differently this time? How about really looking at what will set you up for success and being happy? What do you need to do differently to find a job that aligns with you better? I know you are so frustrated with where you are at right now. I have to say….your boss being “by the book” is a MUCH better “bad” quality compared to the other guys you have had to work for. You at least are being treated well. You are going on adventures that are a once in a lifetime kind of thing. You are figuring it out one day at a time Rhonda. Remember when you couldn’t even get a bank account? It’s working out slowly but surely. I know it’s incredibly frustrating and hard, but I’d hate to see you step into another job that you don’t like even more, just to escape this job. What can you do differently this time around?
How was Sunday? What did you do?
Heidi
Hi Connie,
Welcome! Thank you for sharing what you are struggling with. I just have a few questions.
How long were you married and in that abusive relationship? How many times have you been cheated on? Are you the type where you date for a while before you commit or do you tend to commit pretty quickly? Is there anything you can think of that is common between all of these men? Are you able to look back at each experience and see any signs of potential cheating?
I want to encourage you and let you know that although cheating is a pattern from your past, there are plenty of men who do not cheat. The thing about cheating is, there are many reasons why it happens and the best thing you can do, is find out what is happening within you that this is a pattern in your life. Maybe the guys you are choosing are guys with little integrity. Maybe there is something missing in the relationship. Maybe it’s a little bit of both. You cannot control what someone else chooses, but you can control what YOU choose. So let’s take a journey down that road and see what we can come up with, because it’s awful to be betrayed like that.
What kind of relationship do you want to experience? If you were to rate yourself between 0-10 (10 being amazing!) what number would you give yourself as far as being a good catch? What would you rate yourself as far as being a good romantic partner?
Thank you for being here Connie!
Heidi
Hi Kathy,
Wow. 11 years is a very long time! I am soooo so sorry you are having to go through this! Losing love is incredibly difficult and it takes a while to heal. I wish love were enough to make relationships keep working. If it were, we wouldn’t have such a high divorce rate. Love is the easy part. It’s the merging of 2 worlds full of different stories, experiences, beliefs, wounds etc. that make it tumultuous and cause breakups.
I just have a few questions. First, did you like your relationship? From your perspective, was it healthy, vibrant, and nourishing? Was it a relationship that you loved being in?
What is he saying about you to other people? It might give you a clue as to why he broke up.
I’m wondering…are you willing to just overlook how he is handling all of this? You want him back without REALLY looking at the fact that he broke up without talking about it, he is seeing someone else, he is trash talking you to other people…do you really feel okay to invite someone like that back into your life on a very intimate level? Why do men think they can stomp all over our emotions like that? They think this, because they can. They get to be whoever they want to be. But if YOU accept this behavior and do not set a standard as to how you are treated, then you AGREE to being treated this way and you teach him that he doesn’t have to care about how he treats you.
Im just supposed to go along to make it easier on him? Yes. You are. If you want to be treated a certain way, then you need to require it from him. If he is not aligning with that, then yes…you make it easy on him and disappear, you don’t fight to bring him back into your life. You disappearing is teaching him that you are not going to participate in how he is handling things. If you would rather fight for him, then you get to do that too, but just know that doing that actually is what is making it easy on him because he gets to treat you like crap without any consequence. Bottom line is, YOU are the one who teaches a person how to treat you. What you accept and do not accept is YOUR choice. Your standards are your own design.
Thoughts?
Heidi
Hi V V,
Oh my goodness, you have been through an incredible amount of challenge! I am so so so sorry for what you are dealing with. The loss and bereavement process is a very long and drawn out process and very difficult. Have you gotten any help? There is so much to process!
As far as your guy, the first thing I want to say is, it’s not YOUR job to undo his anger, his hurt, his anything that he is feeling. The fact that he is blaming you for “losing so much time” or that you “should have done better” is a guy who isn’t taking responsibility for his choices. He CHOSE to stay. He CHOSE to participate. He is CHOOSING to be angry and pointing the finger at you. His anger is HIS and for HIM to deal with, not you. You DO NOT need to defend yourself for how he is feeling. It’s NOT okay that he is pointing the finger at you. That kind of victim mentality will sabotage a relationship so quickly. Has he always done this? Over the years, did he tend to point the finger at you and need you to fix things?
Heidi
Thank you for sharing more!
I know it wasn’t the right thing to do cause I wasn’t single but I don’t think he considers it as cheating as well. You may not have physically cheated, but you emotionally cheated. You guys may not use that specific term, but the end result is exactly the same. He doesn’t trust you. He doesn’t feel safe with you. If you did it with him, that means you could do it to him.
But I also feel like I need to prove every day that I want to be with him and I won’t disappear anymore. The moment you step into “proving” anything to him, that’s the moment you lose yourself. If you have truly forgiven yourself and moved on from the past, there is nothing to prove. You cannot promise that you won’t disappear. Disappearing the way you did, is a coping mechanism. My guess is, it’s a pattern you have. Do you have a tendency to run away from confrontation? Do you tend to keep your feelings quiet? Do you have a habit of giving in to what someone wants so you don’t have to disappoint them? My point being, is that you are human and you have coping mechanisms that will hurt him and his coping mechanisms will hurt you too. It’s just part of being in a relationship with anyone. So there is nothing to “prove.” You cannot promise or guarantee any specific behavior and he has to be okay with that. If he isn’t, then he is too fragile to be in any kind of deep, committed relationship. You need to just be yourself. Proving anything to him is playing his game. It’s him holding the past against you and him not moving on. He isn’t forgiving you. He is holding onto the hurt as a barrier to protect himself. The truth is, you could absolutely disappear on him again and it is guaranteed you are going to hurt him again. He needs to come to terms with that if he is going to love you.
how do I not let things go to the point where he would actually “punish” me for things in the past? You don’t participate in this game. The moment you agree to “proving” anything, you are co-creating this dynamic. Have you talked with him about how you learned from your choices? You say you won’t disappear again, but what makes you think that’s true? You spent 4 years with a guy that was comfortable. That, in a way, is you disappearing from yourself and not fighting for more in your life. You spent 2 years connecting and disconnecting with a new guy and not being honest with the current guy. That was also you running away from yourself and not willing to truly face your feelings. You obviously feel clear at the moment, but your pattern of how you handle your feelings doesn’t just disappear. It’s a pattern that probably has existed in some sort of variation over many decades. And there’s nothing “wrong” with it! What’s important, is that if you are going to get him back, and if it’s going to be healthy and honest, you have to start with being honest with yourself. Any guy who is being invited into my world knows that my coping mechanism is to run away also. I tend to get very quiet, I disonnect, I become unreachable and I have very strong passive aggressive tendencies. I will ALWAYS be like this and it’s extremely hurtful to someone. So…my goal is to manage it in healthy ways and that is what I present to a partner. I let him know that this is me and I have a plan on how to handle myself when I start to disconnect. I teach him about some of the signs I might be showing and how he can identify them and even call me out on it. I make him part of my process. Does it work all the time? Of course not. We all are super messy when we get hurt in one way or another. That’s why it’s so incredibly important to develop your self love, your skills in stress management and also to have high communication with your partner. In the end, there is no guarantee that even with everything perfectly in place, that things will work out. Love is a risk. It’s going to hurt and it’s going to bring you joy in such powerful ways. Your guy is in a space of trying to find some sort of guarantee that you won’t hurt him again, he isn’t forgiving and letting go of the past and it’s all a way to try and not get hurt. It’s a battle he has already lost before it started, cuz it’s just not possible.
Thoughts?
Heidi
Oh wow! You both have really gone through a lot. There is a lot of history here, especially in the past couple of years of you disappearing and reappearing all the time, because you had a boyfriend. When you talk about what happened in the past and you cheating on your boyfriend with him, what do you say about it? How do you handle his fear about you doing the same thing to him?
His fears that are coming up I have no doubt have to do with the war and him facing death. You just happen to be a great target. By that, I mean, when someone is facing potential death and trauma, especially when it’s war and his whole entire life is about to change – he isn’t going to have a clue about what he wants to do with you. He is going to feel the spectrum of emotions from anger to resentment, to deep love and connection. Think about it…you are about to go off and maybe die and never see him again. Would you be able to think straight about a relationship that hasn’t been established yet? He is terrified and confused and all over the place, as most people would be. I imagine his coldness is his way of protecting himself. Maybe he doesn’t want to miss you and love you while he fighting a war. Maybe he feels he is doing the noble thing and protecting you from him dying. The less you feel, the less you hurt. Either way, coldness is a protective/survival mechanism, so he definitely is in a lot of fear.
I want to suggest to just put your relationship away for right now. He is doing something that is changing his entire life right now and it’s painful and hard and terrifying. Focus on supporting him. Stop trying to get something from him and just be his friend for right now. He needs consistency, he needs support, he needs encouragement. So what if he is cold. He is just afraid. Be there anyways. Keep sending him messages about home, funny videos to make him laugh, ask how he is doing etc. Talk about everything except the relationship. If he doesn’t respond, that’s okay. Don’t take it personal.
As far as talking about your past and cheating on your ex, if it comes up again, I would approach it in this way: “I know that what I did was not in my integrity. I learned I was capable of cheating and I didn’t know that about myself. I also learned that I can feel things I didn’t know were possible when you came along. And I was really scared. It’s a powerful connection that you and I have and I honestly didn’t know what to do with it. I wish I had handled everything differently, but I cannot take it back. The best I can do is learn so I can be a better partner. I’m not going to promise you that I won’t make the same mistake again. Now that I know I am capable of cheating, it makes me much more aware that I could do it again. With that being said, it also makes me more on high alert that if something like this starts to show up again, I know how to better handle it. Either way, I’m not perfect, I have learned and I want to be better. I have forgiven myself for how I behaved. If that is something you are not able to do, I will honor your choice, but it makes me sad for you that you feel you have to hold onto the past like this. It’s not how I want to live my life, so no matter how amazing our connection is, we are not like-minded in this and it will break us apart. So I’m interested in only holding onto the lessons of the past and nothing else. I understand that you don’t want to join me in that. I will respect that.”
One thing I do want to say is that if he keeps holding this over your head, he is showing you that he has a REALLY hard time forgiving. So anytime you hurt him, he most likely will hold onto that hurt for a very long time. It will just continue to build and build and build and he will keep “punishing” you for things you did years ago that you already moved on from. Be careful with this pattern. It’s destructive and people who operate like this, have MASSIVE walls that you will never get past. Don’t play this kind of game. DO NOT let him keep bringing you to the past and participate in that conversation anymore. Talk about what you learned about yourself, about him, about the situation…but DO NOT talk about anything else that isn’t productive. He needs to join you in the present moment and if he isn’t willing to do that, then he is not equipped to handle a relationship. Does this make sense?
Thoughts?
Heidi
Thank you for sharing!
It sounds like he is still wanting to stay connected on some level. If that is not what you want right now, it’s important that you communicate that. You can always just say something simple like “My heart is broken. Being in contact with you other than for the dog, is just too hurtful right now. I need some time. Can we just create some space for a while? I will let you know when I feel more able to be casual and friendly without it hurting. If you are on the same page at that time, I would love to be friends.”
You said you tried the no contact rule. Did you do it for the full 30 days? Why do you think it didn’t work?
I think a really important thing to focus on right now is becoming a better partner. He told you why it just isn’t working anymore for him, so what have you done to fix that behavior? How have you worked on yourself? What have you done to connect to that part of yourself that likes to play the victim? If you want him back, then that’s the part of you that really needs some healing and new skills about how to communicate, especially during challenging times. You guys cannot fall back into the same pattern. Unless he sees and experiences you really shifting that part, he isn’t going to feel safe to step back in.
Thoughts?
Heidi
Hi Jasmine,
I was hoping to continue the conversation with you. How are you feeling? Any thoughts about what I said? Any new developments?
Heidi
