[Heidi G]

Hi Abby,

I’m so glad that what I shared resonated for you!

I love that you both are looking at how each of you contributed to what has shown up. That’s fantastic!

I’m curious, have you reconnected? The way you are talking “he and I are stronger than ever” sounds like something has shifted between the both of you.

Heidi

[Heidi G]

Hi Elisa,

I’m glad you feel more comfortable with how to approach the therapy session.

As far as you criticizing and consuming yourself with your child, be kind to yourself. You were doing the very best that you knew how. Now you know a different way to approach things. It’s something you will do for the rest of your life. I know soooooooo much about relationships, yet I still mess up. I still have my coping mechanisms, I still have lessons to learn. It’s a forever process you have to come to grips with. YOU ARE NOT THE ONLY REASON HE HAS PULLED AWAY. I really want you to receive this as best you can. Yes, you contributed, but let’s say you did things perfectly. I guarantee you, there would have been other things to face within the relationship. He contributed as well. There were plenty of things he did and did not do that brought you both to where you are at right now. My point being, DO NOT TAKE FULL RESPONSIBILITY. Forgive yourself for your limitations, accept it’s just part of the process, and keep your head up as you move forward. Beating yourself up for your past or blaming and shaming yourself will keep the growth of your relationship VERY stunted and that’s not what you want. Use your limitations as a teacher and NOT as fuel for regret. That will destroy you and the relationship. Forgive yourself. Love yourself. Have compassion for yourself and be proud that you are the kind of person that is learning and asking for help. Do you know how rare that is??? Do you know how much courage that takes??? A LOT!!! I have been coaching people for over 20 years and it’s a rare person who takes action towards healing and becoming better when they realize how they were sabotaging the relationship. I have a lot of respect for you to be here asking for some help as well as being willing to work with a therapist. Good for him too! It’s a start.

I know you are so scared of losing him. I know he feels closed off. It’s okay! As closed as he is, it is absolutely possible for him to open up again. He is closed, because he doesn’t feel safe. He doesn’t feel safe with you, but even deeper than that and at the core of him, he doesn’t feels safe within himself first and foremost. He won’t see it that way because it takes a very conscious person to know that about themselves. He needs to forgive you and himself and people from his past that have caused him pain, criticized him, hurt him, and blocked him. It’s a lot of work to face that inside. It’s not easy and it definitely takes some time. I hope he is willing to forgive, because if not, then he will just become more miserable the older he gets. And if he is not willing to forgive, then that is on him and there is nothing you can do about that. Some people just have a very high need to hold onto their anger and hurt for various reasons. Maybe in time, he will be work into that space of letting go. Who knows. But that really is HIS side of things and what HE needs to face about himself. Forgiving doesn’t mean he will want to be in the relationship again, but at the very least, forgiveness will allow a more clear and authentic connection.

In the end Elisa, no matter what happens, your job is to learn, accept, forgive, grow and continue working on your dad stuff so you can become a more powerful connector with a man, as a mom, and as a friend. However relationships turn out, is how they turn out and you will never have control over the outcome. I’ve had deep friendships end in a matter of a single conversation. I’ve had family members I haven’t talked to in over 20 years. I cannot control how others respond. I can control how I feel about myself, how I treat myself, and how I connect with others. The rest is just going to be whatever it is. Each experience has many lessons for growth and that is what relationships are for. So even if this doesn’t turn out the way you want…you can heal and you can absolutely fall in love again and have a healthier, more vibrant experience. Anything is possible. So anytime you feel afraid, you remind yourself….”I am resourceful. I know how to get help. I am open and willing to grow, therefore I can heal. I will be okay, even if I lose him.”

Heidi

[Heidi G]

Hi Elisa,

Thank you for being here and sharing your story. I’m so sorry for what you both are facing as it definitely is not easy. It sounds like a very layered and complicated situation. I love that what you have read so far, has helped you understand some of what has pushed him away and how you can shift things from your side.

What’s important to understand is that it always is a 2 way street. No matter what you did or didn’t do “correctly” to push him away, him pulling away is also HIS doing as well. Make sure not to put all the blame on yourself. With everything you both have been going through, it sounds like there are MANY things that have influenced where you both are at right now.

One of the best ways you can support him and open him up to the idea of continuing to work on things is to go in with the mindset that whatever his experience and thought process is, it’s true FOR HIM and that needs to be honored, respected, and validated. Some of his thinking may or may not resonate for you as well, but it doesn’t matter. It’s HIS experience that true for him, so being curious about the depths of his experience, being understanding and honoring his choices, even though it’s not what you want…that is soooooo important!!! When a person feels like they are being accepted and respected, many times it helps them breathe easier. He may be going into the session in protective mode and feeling like he needs to defend himself, so give him a different experience of you. Instead of trying to make him do what YOU want and going into it with your agenda of fixing things, look at this experience with the only goal to get to know him better and from a different perspective. Learn more about him. Learn more about yourself. If THAT is 100% your focus, then no matter what happens – whether you end up together or not – you will have become a better partner, you have learned new ways to navigate challenges, you will have learned new relationship skills, and you will have learned more about yourself. This mindset isn’t giving up on the relationship, but instead just honoring that it’s broken and that’s okay. I love that you both are getting a 3rd person involved to help you navigate this. I hope they are helpful and effective and that you both like this person. THAT”S IMPORTANT!!! You BOTH need to feel safe and trusting with this person, so if you don’t agree, then find another person. DO NOT force this. The right person can save your marriage and the wrong person can cause you guys to end it, so whomever you are seeing is a very important piece. Just because they are a therapist and have experience DOES NOT mean they are good at what they do or that they are a good fit. So keep an open mind.

Healing a marriage is marathon, not a sprint. BE OKAY with taking things slow and making baby steps. Even if he decides to continue with separating, 6 months down the road, he may change his mind because how you relate to each has changed and is more healthy and he feels safe and trusting of the relationship.

Tell me more about how you feel you have messed things up. What exactly were you doing that pushed him away? And what changes are you wanting to make?

Heidi

[Heidi G]

Hi Abby! Thank you for sharing more details! It’s helpful.

Your deepest wounds as well as his, are VERY common. Men tend to feel like they are not enough and women tend to feel I am unlovable….they both are the same exact thing, but the nuances change because of a female perspective vs. a male perspective.
So basically, you are both feeling the same exact thing, just with a little different flavor to it.

So here is the thing Abby…these core challenges are NEVER going to go away completely. They will always be there on some level. The goal is to do healing around the events from your past that fuel the stories AND develop a skillset on how to handle these triggers in a healthy way.

Most people handle their core challenges by running away or looking to the other person to change their behavior so they don’t have to feel bad. The thing is Abby, nobody will ever be able to escape these kinds of feelings. I am a pretty emotionally healthy person and I absolutely feel like I am not lovable many times. However, I know how to handle it in a productive way and in a way that keeps me connected to the truth (I am lovable) and in a way that doesn’t sabotage connection. That’s the only difference between you and me.

I don’t know a person a live who isn’t afraid of commitment on a core level. That also is just something that is going to be there. Love is scary! There is no way around that. It’s a risk ALWAYS. It’s absolutely a guarantee the person you give your heart to, is going to hurt you. You are going to hurt them. It’s part of the journey of love. It’s possible you or them decide to call it quits. It’s possible you end up lasting forever. Who the heck knows. The truth and reality about life, is all we have is this very moment. Tomorrow, you may get into a car accident and die. You may fall and end up in a wheelchair for the rest of your life. Anything can happen at any given moment, so if you make decisions from a place of fear about a future that hasn’t even happened and may never happened, then fear is controlling your life. I know you did not decide to walk away from this and that it was his decision. I’m specifically addressing your fear and how it controlled you into being critical and demanding. It’s controlling him by causing him to run away. You BOTH need to first and foremost, acknowledge the fear, and then handle it in a way that honors the fear and move through it in a respectful way TOGETHER.

I understand your are taking time apart, so I suggest that during this time, you really dig deep in understanding yourself and develop a skillset to handle your fear differently moving forward. Most men need the woman to be the role model about how to handle the relationship better. If YOU start to shift and change, it’s very possible he may follow your lead. If he doesn’t, then at the very least, you took the time to become a better partner, more connected to yourself, and more empowered for whomever you open your heart to again down the road.

Thoughts on this?

Heidi

[Heidi G]

Hi Abby,

Welcome! We are glad you are here to explore how to move through your situation in the best possible way.

I just have a few questions.

he’s got to let me go because he feels he cannot give me the love I deserve. What does this mean? It’s such a general reason, so what specifically does he feel like he cannot give you?

Upon reflection, I can see all the ways I unconsciously pushed him away and sabotage things Tell me more about this. I imagine you feel that whatever you were doing, it influenced how he feels incapable of providing you with what you need, yes? Do you know where these sabotaging patterns came from? What are you afraid of?

I’m also wondering what HIS sabotaging patterns were as well. We all have them, so what were the ways he pushed you away?

Heidi

[Heidi G]

I keep giving in because he has a confidence issue This is not about him. This is about you trying to rescue and fix him and that is NOT your job. It absolutely is NOT a healthy dynamic to build a relationship on. Each person needs to know how to take care of themselves. If he has confidence issues, it’s for HIM to fix within himself. None of us can ever fix those kind of issues for other people. It’s impossible.

at first I thought he was catfishing me It is absolutely possible that he is catfishing you. There are PLENTY of people out there that know exactly what they need to say and be like in order to keep someone hooked. It’s a game to people like that. They are VERY skilled and women are the ones that fall for it the most and easiest. I suggest you are VERY careful. You have no idea who this guy really is until you actually meet him in person and have experiences with him to know that he is actually is who he says he is. All the pictures of plane tickets etc. are super easy to photoshop. What you DO know is that he is not willing to meet you in person and that is a BIG RED FLAG!!!! Either he is catfishing you and using a lack of confidence and anxiety as his cover story….which honestly is the most likely scenario. If he is so worried about money and doesn’t feel he has enough to take care of you, then why is he supposedly spending money on plane tickets and then turning around and flying home? That is throwing money right down the drain. Honestly, that’s a VERY questionable story. If everything he says is actually true, then his lack of confidence is SO BIG that he is not available to be anyone’s partner. Relationships and love require confidence and there is no way around that. If he doesn’t even have enough confidence to meet you in person, then he will be a partner you cannot rely on. Anytime something gets hard, he will run. He will not be able to emotionally support you through stressful times. You will end up feeling VERY lonely in this relationship. So either way you spin this situation….catfishing or seriously low self-esteem, this guy is a SERIOUS project and YOU are saying to this. His life, his happiness, his confidence, is NOT YOUR JOB!!! Focus on yourself instead.

he feels bad about the way he is treating me but what if he is like me and not know the correct way to treat a woman ? This is NOT about how to treat a woman…it’s about how to treat a person! What kind of person keeps saying he is going to do something and never follows through. How many times is he going to apologize? How many times is he going to break his word? How many times is he going to betray what he says? Anybody…friend or potential lover would not appreciate being treated that way. There is no trust and when there is no trust, there is no safety and there is a very chaotic relationship full of drama. I don’t care how hard he works to get you back (if he is catfishing you, that’s part of the game they play), it’s not changing the result….he is not willing to see you. So again, the issue is with YOU saying yes to being treated this way.

how do I explain that to him that’s the problem why he doesn’t meet me in person You don’t know that this is the problem. You hardly know the guy. And IF this is true, it’s for HIM to work out in his own mind and not your job to change how he thinks and feels.

he will take the time to chase me down for 3 months he chased me finally I gave in because he seems genuinely interested and wants to work thru this for a person to do all that work to get back it’s got be worth to give him another chance right? Absolutely not. It’s been 8 times. You have given him plenty of chances. He either needs to come meet you in person or it needs to be over. How many more times is it going to take before you get the message? He doesn’t want to meet you in person bad enough. Again, he is either catfishing you or he is highly dysfunctional….is that really what you want?

I’m thinking you are more attracted to the feeling of having a guy fight so hard for you, that you choose to ignore all of the MAJOR RED FLAGS. I get it. I have been in that place before and the only way to start to heal and choose better, is to start saying NO to all those experiences where you are treated poorly. I know he has been there for you in a lot of different ways, but in the end…none of that matters if he isn’t willing to meet you in person. All you are doing is having a relationship with a guy over technology. Really? Is that really what you are willing to settle for?

Heidi

[Heidi G]

Oh Tabitha! I am so so sorry you are going through this. I’m wondering, what keeps pulling you back into him? He obviously is not willing to meet you in person, so that’s a BIG deal breaker. What is happening for you, that you keep saying yes to him? I imagine this is not how you want to be treated. It hurts every time. He obviously has no integrity in his words, which means you don’t trust him nor feel safe with him. How come you keep going back? So what that he finds a way to contact you. You don’t have to respond. But you are responding and he knows he can pull you back into connecting with him. You are teaching him that how he treats you is okay, every single time you go back to him. So this situation is really not about him and his behaviors. It’s about you saying yes to this treatment. How come?

Heidi

[Heidi G]

And I’m really impressed at the time you give to the responses on all the threads I’ve read, it’s wonderful and so generous OMG! You seriously just made my day! I had a super rough start to my morning by making someone VERY angry with my advice. It happens sometimes. So reading your kind words and having you acknowledge my caring heart, well….it made me feel seen. Thank you thank you thank you!!! Seriously!

I’d rather be single and available to meet someone who I can respect and love this way, than to be in a relationship with someone who I feel anything less for. I just don’t know if I’ll find that. I LOVE LOVE LOVE this. This is the BIGGEST sticking point, mostly for women. We are the relationship caretakers and when we love and feel bonded, we definitely have a tendency to negotiate away our standards so we can stay connected. We think we can help. We think we can save. We think we can support. We hope for change. So we keep hanging on. It’s probably the #1 coaching topic I talk about with women. The one thing I always ask them and they wrestle with is this…”Is it a loving thing TO YOU, to love this man who is unavailable for you?” The answer always is no, of course. And that’s the journey. When love is healthy, when connection is healthy, it’s loving to YOU FIRST and then it’s loving to him as well. Relationships are 3 entities. There is you, there is him, there is the relationship. It’s absolutely possible, just like in your case, that you love yourself, you love him, but you don’t LOVE the relationship itself. You have moments you love, but overall, the 3rd component is not something you love all the time. This is where women get stuck. They love the guy, but they don’t love the relationship itself. It’s a tough one to really come to terms with. I love that you are able to align with the truth of the situation and who he is, for today at least. This shows how much strength you have. It’s going to be journey to let him go and will take some time. I will be here as your support anytime you need it.

You are right, this is so deeply painful to love someone so much and not know how to help. And I don’t want to cause more pain. Watching someone you love be in pain is so incredibly challenging. What helps me though…is viewing pain as a gift. The truth is, pain is a motivator right? It has the ability to create movement like nothing else can. He has not hit rock bottom yet, to do anything about his pain. He is wallowing and swimming in the pain…which acts as a protective mechanism. At this point, the pain is serving him by keeping everyone at a distance. He would rather be in pain and alone than to face his fear of intimacy and allow someone into his life to see and know his greatness and his darkness. That takes strength and self-esteem…something he doesn’t have right now. So you can help him, by NOT trying to rescue him from his pain. He needs it to continue to get worse (and it will) so that it becomes soooooo uncomfortable that he actually starts to do something about it. Usually, there is a point that someone will start to fight for themselves. Of course there are those that give up and decide to leave this earth and people like that don’t want help – and there is nothing we can do about it. As long as his mom is alive, it sounds like he feels purpose and that’s good. So you can be a listening ear. You can be a friend from a distance. You can send him links to articles or videos talking about depression. Here are a few: https://www.ted.com/playlists/287/4_ted_talks_on_overcoming_depr

What will harm him, is you getting involved and trying to rescue him. You have to learn to be okay that he is hurting. You have to have the perspective that his pain is designed to help him grow and he NEEDS it to get worse so he can finally get help. So you alleviating any kind of pain for him just prolongs the process. Here is an analogy that may help you understand this concept:
This story has been told a gazillion different ways, but I think you will get the point….https://www.instituteofcuriosity.com/the-butterfly-story/

Does this help?

Heidi

[Heidi G]

Great! I’m so glad to hear that you are shifting your perspective about the event! This is a side of myself that isn’t easy for me to love I get it! We all have sides to ourselves that are embarrassing, harmful, hurtful and just plain frustrating. It’s always difficult to love those parts of ourselves. Just this morning, in efforts to help someone with their dog’s nutrition (an area of expertise I have), I ended up just pissing him off to no end. All he heard from what I said, was that he was wrong. Even though that was not what I was doing, it triggered him and I definitely did not help him having a good start to his day. I saw where I was ineffective and why he had felt that way and how I shared the information was not in a way that inspired him to want to learn more. Anyways, I had to spend some time with myself afterwards, working on loving and accepting that I caused someone a lot of anger. I had to use my techniques to help me move the bad feeling I had about myself, out of my mind and body. I had to forgive myself for how I approached the situation. It’s tough! I’ve been doing this stuff for years and even in a silly, small moment like this, it was hard! It’s hard for everyone. But if you really think about it, if your guy had a panic attack in front of you, wouldn’t you have the ultimate compassion for him? Wouldn’t your heart just want to love on him and help him feel okay? Wouldn’t you have patience for him? Why do you think you would be able to offer all of that kindness and love and compassion to him, but not yourself?

How can I do that without being needy? FANTASTIC question!!! There is a difference between being “needy” and “needing” help. Being needy is co-dependent. It means that you DO NOT know how to be okay without him. You DO NOT know how to be happy, feel complete, have strong self-esteem without him reassuring you, without him telling you, without him showing you…all the time. It’s a bucket that NEVER gets filled. So the guy will do it in the beginning, but when a woman constantly is “needy” by always asking for assurances so she can feel safe, it’s a complete turnoff for a guy. It’s when a woman has a void inside and is constantly looking to HIM to fill it. It gets expressed in a million different ways, but in the end, it’s when a woman is relying on her man to feel happy by defining her happiness by his words and actions…it drains the life out of the man.

Needing is more about receiving his help, receiving his compliments, receiving his efforts without constantly needing them. I ask for help all the time from guys…do I need it? Nope. Do I enjoy it? Yep. Sometimes I will ask directly for assurances, but there is a specific purpose and I’m helping him be my “hero” so to speak. Do I NEED him to do that for me? Nope. If he weren’t available, I have other resources to help me. What I know is that I am confident, resilient, resourceful and can absolutely live my life 100% without a man….therefore, I do not NEED a man. But when I do have a man, I absolutely enlist his help, his advice, his comfort, his manliness….not because I “need” it, but because I love it. It makes me feel good and it makes him feel good. It puts a woman in her feminine energy of receiving and the man in his masculine of doing and providing.

So in summary, being needy means you HAVE to have it to function and you depend on him. But needing him in healthy ways means you don’t have to have it, but it’s definitely nice to receive and it feels good for him to offer it. both so he can feel like he has purpose and so I can experience the pleasure of leaning on him. This is healthy. This is supportive and bonding and working together as a team. Needy is clingy…needy is desperate…needy is dependent. It’s a very different energetic texture that most guys run from.

Did I explain this well? It’s so hard to type this one out.

Heidi

[Heidi G]

Hello there!

Welcome to the forum. Thank you for sharing your story. I’m soooo so sorry for what you are going through. It’s incredibly difficult to feel so connected with a man who is not able to reciprocate. I have no doubt he loves you, but it sounds like the depression has taken over and is running his life.

I’ve promised myself that I won’t settle, like we each said before anything happened. Let’s talk about this a little more. What does that mean to you? What are your standards? How do you expect to be treated, even in the worst moments?

Here is the thing that is going to be EXTREMELY difficult to come to terms with. He is emotionally unavailable for you. I know he has some amazing qualities and it sounds like you guys really had a wonderful and respectful connection was was really beautiful. The thing is though (studies have looked at this extensively) what makes or breaks a relationship is how the couple treats each other when under stress. We all have our coping mechanisms. We all have ways that we respond to stress that can sabotage connection, but they are our survival mechanisms. Whatever our coping mechanisms are, they are with us forever. Some get depressed, some are more oriented to anxiety, some blame and shame, some get very overt and angry, some play the victim etc. The difference between all of us, is HOW we handle when we are in a trigger. For me, I pull away. I become a recluse and definitely get passive aggressive in various ways. Before, I used to let my coping mechanisms run the show. Now, I have accountability, I have techniques I use to manage my emotions, I have very wise friends who are skilled at helping me see more clearly, I have a coach who knows how to help me clear the negative energy and stories that got triggered….I have a whole system set up to help me, so that when I am in a trigger, I am taking care of it right away instead of sabotaging connection.

This seems to be missing in your guy. He is letting the depression control him and sabotage connection with you. The stories in his system are sooooo strong that the doesn’t have any way to belief anything else except that he is not good enough….and his system will show him all kinds of evidence for that. It doesn’t matter what you say or believe. It only matters what HE says and believes about himself. You cannot give him self-esteem. He has to fight for that himself. As long as he traverses this road alone and doesn’t ask for professional help whether through therapy or group coaching or doing SOMETHING to help himself, he will stay trapped in this spiral and be unavailable to everyone. He may come out of it as life circumstances change, or he may completely lose himself.

I know you love him so deeply. I know it’s incredibly awful to watch someone you care about, fall into this dark pit of lies. Honestly, it’s hard to say what you can do. What I CAN tell you, is that if he is not the type to fight for himself in his worst moments, then he is not going to be a good long term partner for anyone. You say you don’t want to settle, but what he is showing you about HOW he is handling his depression, is a deal breaker. You would be entering into a relationship with a man who has A LOT of low self-esteem, no skillset or understanding to handle that low self-esteem, and therefore not emotionally stable or available for you as a “partner,” as a “teammate.” It is EXTREMELY challenging for partners who are with someone dealing with depression, even when the depressed person is actively working on healing. The main thing I hear is that is SLOWLY drains the life out of the partner trying to support them. The depression overshadows EVERTHING. The partner ends up spending all their time and energy trying to “lift up” their partner and support them, all the while not really getting to exist in the relationship. The depressed person can’t be happy for the good things happening in their partner’s life, the depressed person can’t even be present for regular conversations, and the partner sure as heck can’t talk about any of their challenges or frustrations.

As you are already seeing, your guy has very little to offer you right now. I know you want to stay present with him and that’s okay, but be careful not to get into the mindset of becoming his caretaker and constantly trying to pull him out of his shell. He HAS TO FIGHT for himself and he doesn’t want to do that, then your relationship has no foundation to stand on. The best thing you can do is to get into a space of acceptance and let him go. He is not able to offer you that deep, intimate love you crave. He has to face his depression and get a hold of it first and foremost and who knows if and when he will make that choice. All you have to go by is TODAY…and TODAY, he is not available. He is not a partner. He is not a teammate. He can’t even be there for himself, so he cannot be there for you and be present for you. So if you don’t want to settle, then that means NOT negotiating away your standards and saying goodbye to a man who is not able to meet your needs.

I know how hard this idea is. You have deeply bonded with him and it won’t be easy. It will be painful. It will also be more painful to stay connected to him and keep this dream alive of you guys being together “one day” and never have it come to fruition. Or maybe it does and then one day, life happens as it always does, and he falls into depression again and pulls away. That is the kind of life you are looking at. If you want to say yes to that, then keep supporting him and keep the dream alive and wait for him. If you want more from love and if you want more for your heart, then it’s time to let go of your dream of being with him. FOR TODAY. It doesn’t mean that down the road something can’t happen. Hopefully at some point he really gets a hold of this depression and gets some help. Either way, you don’t know what the future holds. All you know is that TODAY, he is not available for you, so you need to decide if you are going to settle for that and wait around or decide it’s not healthy for you and you want more and you say goodbye.

I know this is not a fun choice. Either direction, you are facing some pain.

I’m so so sorry you are having to go through this!

Thoughts?

Heidi

[Heidi G]

Hi Lili! Yes, I got this last message where you said you keep getting error messages, so it looks like it’s working now!

Heidi

[Heidi G]

I’m not a “friends with benefits” type of woman. Do you see how you are negotiating away your standards? You say this isn’t the type of woman you are, yet that is what you are choosing to be with him. Your words and your actions are NOT in alignment. What do you expect him to think about you? You are teaching him already that you don’t have integrity in your words (in this area of your life) and that teaches him NOT to trust what you say. You are asking him to have integrity with how he treats you, yet you are not having integrity with how you treat yourself. Do you see how this sets up a double standard? You are wanting HIM to do for you what you are not even willing to do for yourself, so that sets HIM up to be the person that makes you feel okay in this relationship, instead of taking on that responsibility yourself. Does this make sense?

I told him that all I want right now is 1. For him to be honest with me like he wasn’t before and 2. That he has to promise he doesn’t disappear again. This again is requiring him to be something specific so YOU can be okay. This is you not accepting that he is who he is. The reality is, he will not be honest again and he absolutely has the ability to disappear on you again. It doesn’t matter what he says. It doesn’t matter how bad he felt about what happened in the past. He responded from his coping mechanism which means, unless he does some deep work where he is working with his triggers and learning new ways to navigate them, he will ALWAYS revert back to his coping mechanism – which is to run away. It’s no different than you having your coping mechanism to rely on the guy to make you feel better. Can I just tell you “Don’t do this anymore” and expect that you won’t? Absolutely not! No matter how much I explain to you how this is hurting you and your relationships, or how much this is a destructive pattern, it’s not something that you can just stop doing. It requires first, to dissect it and understand it, and then second, working with your coping mechanisms on a deeper level and healing what caused this pattern in the first place. So it’s unrealistic to expect him NOT to behave in the same exact again. He of course, doesn’t want to, but the reality is, it’s going to happen in some form or fashion again – just like your coping mechanisms are running the show right now. So instead of asking him NOT to do those things, it’s your job to do 2 things:

1. Accept this is who he is and always will be – our coping mechanisms are with us FOREVER. They never change and they never go away. All that changes is how we deal with them. My coping mechanism is EXACTLY like his. I have just learned how to manage it differently so I don’t cause harm. Am I perfect at it? Absolutely not. I do mess up sometimes, but I recover VERY quickly. But most of the time, when my reaction is to run, I have my skills, I have my coach, I some friends that I immediately activate to help me work through my trigger so that I don’t sabotage the connection. Before, I would just disconnect and deal with the consequences later. I sure hurt a lot of people along the way.

2. In your acceptance of him, it is YOUR job to learn how to be okay even when he falls into his humanness and his coping mechanisms take over. Every single one of us has destructive patterns and ways that we sabotage intimacy. I don’t know if his therapist has the skillset to do the deeper work and equip him with skills to navigate his triggers differently. If he is only doing talk therapy, that is not enough. It’s not deep enough work to shift what is driving those patterns. So…all you have to go by is who he is today.

I told him he hurt me so badly that right now the only thing I want is to physically feel good with him. Do you think so little of your body that you are willing to have sex with him when you don’t even feel emotionally safe with him? What is this about? Do you not view your body as sacred and a privilege for a man to interact with? I’m curious how you view sex…not in general, but about yourself specifically. What are your standards? What do you require in order to have sex with a man?

When you said I’m using “those guys” to fill me up, I’m not sure what you meant by that. Thank you for asking this! Let me see if I can explain this better. With the way you talk and how you view the 2 guys you have posted about here, it’s clear how much you NEED them to be a certain way so you can feel okay about yourself vs. staying empowered and confident in who you are, regardless of the choices a guy makes. You have this pattern with 2 different guys and I can tell it’s a STRONG pattern with how you perceive what is happening. If you are this age and functioning with these 2 guys with this mindset, it means you have done this other times in your past as well. It’s a coping mechanism. No judgement at all. Believe me, I have my own coping mechanisms that are toxic to me and others. We ALL do. My goal here is to just shine a light on what you are asking about. The more you can see your coping mechanism and how they are sabotaging yourself, the more empowered you can become to navigate connection differently. Here are some examples:

1.How long should I wait before I ask if he felt a connection and if he wants a second date? few days? A week? I hate this part of dating and it makes me mad that my time was wasted for 6 months this year :(. This statement is showing your complete focus and concern as to whether or not the guy likes you vs. you having a mindset where you are vetting him. A woman who is empowered thinks like “I had a great time. If he doesn’t initiate a second date with me, then I’m moving on. I deserve a man who is inspired by me and has a natural desire to want to get to know me. Anything less than that is not worth my time and energy.” This is the mindset of a woman who has A LOT of self-respect. She is connected to her value. She knows her worth, whether or not the guy shows up for her. She has standards as to how she is to be treated and doesn’t negotiate away those standards. Your mindset is the other way around. You are putting your value in HIS hands.You HATE this part of dating because you are waiting around for the GUY to say you are valuable by asking you on a second date. You feel like you wasted the last 6 months because it didn’t turn out the way you wanted. You are soooooo focused on falling in love and having that deep meaningful connection, that you are missing the lessons along the way, teaching you about yourself. It’s as if falling in love will fill that void, because you will have finally arrived at that “complete” place. I say this, because this is your attitude when it doesn’t go the way you want: I GIVE UP! or I hate this part of dating and it makes me mad that my time was wasted for 6 months this year :(. or How do I guard myself?

2. I know you told me that i Should hold off on opening up my heart, but I’m so done for!
I’m so totally into him! This shows no discernment. You completely opened the flood gates to your heart with a guy who is dealing with depression, clearly needed things to go slow, is in therapy trying to figure himself out…so basically you gave this guy ALL of you and “fell in love with him” all the while he is NOT emotionally available to be able to reciprocate that. He still needs to take meds to deal with the level of depression in his system. He is not strong enough yet to be able to deal with the stressors of life, love, work or anything without medication. You are letting your feelings guide you completely instead of looking at how the relationship actually functions as well. You are ignoring MANY red flags so you can keep feeling this connection. Where are your standards? And you are making the same exact choice again. You are choosing to connect with a guy you don’t trust, you don’t feel safe with, and who is still not emotionally available. You are playing with fire. You are trying to figure out, how do I connect with this guy without REALLY connecting. It’s not possible. You are bonding with him, plain and simple. It may appear to be slower, but nonetheless you are bonding. You are trying to do this without getting hurt again, but the reality is, if he were to text you today and say he wants to end things because it’s just not right yet, you would be deeply hurt and angry.

3. I definitely don’t want breadcrumbs. I asked him if he would like to go on a date in the next month or so, and he said he would love to. So, i just need to proceed with caution. How do i do that though? Is this stupid and foolish of me? You don’t want breadcrumbs, yet that’s what you are setting yourself up for. You are doing this to him by having sex with him, but at the same time holding back. You haven’t forgiven him, so you are now punishing him by holding back your heart, yet you will have sex with him? That’s bread crumbing. That’s revenge. You are wanting to hurt him back by withholding, while still giving him a taste of you through sex. I know he is viewing this as the ball in your court, so you are the one to ask him on the date, but this is you setting up the design again. It’s you taking the lead and that inherently goes against the natural way that men and women function in the courting process.

So what EXACTLY do you think you need to let go of the past? What do you need from him to feel safe again? You say you want to be cautious, and rightly so, but being cautious out of fear is toxic. Being cautious and discerning because you have standards that you expect to be met, so you are feeling things out…THAT is healthy. So what do you want from this guy?

I know I have said a lot here. I know I am coming across strong and blunt. I hope that is okay. My goal is to help you align more with the truth vs. thinking you are doing one thing, when you are not. You have a beautiful heart and beautiful intentions, but you are operating under false pretenses. So my goal is to support your beautiful heart and beautiful connection with truth and understanding about how you function. It’s important to honor yourself by functioning from the truth.

Let me know your thoughts! I’m hoping this wasn’t too much that it caused you to shut down. If this is what happens, PLEASE be honest and let me know. I want to help you, not shut you down. This platform is incredibly difficult sometimes, because I cannot “read” you or “feel” you in the moment and vice versa.

Heidi

[Heidi G]

I guess I shouldn’t make decisions for my own love life. I’m curious….what do you mean by this?

I don’t regret it , and truthfully i really missed the connection This is what I call a “fishhook.” You are so starved for connection that you are willing to use your body to get it. The thing is, it’s not REALLY connection. It’s a bandaid. We all do this in many different ways, whether it’s emotional eating, spending money to make ourselves feel better etc…it’s all in efforts to help ourselves feel better through external ways. It works for a bit, but it doesn’t actually solve anything, because we end up right back where we started. I used to use sex the same exact way…I used it to boost my self esteem by getting to feel “wanted” and being able to have some kind of power by making the guy feel good and him associating that with me. I had such a GIANT void inside (I didn’t really understand it back then), that men were the way I filled it.

How do I guard myself? Of course you are going to want more. You can’t help it. By understanding your fishhooks and what “hooks” you into a guy that isn’t really the full package, it at least brings you awareness about what you are choosing to step into. You have to decide what you really want Lisa. Do you want to settle for bread crumbing or do you want to fall in love and have healthy connection? If you want the latter, you are going to have to say no to the guys who are offering you less. That’s going to be incredibly tough, because you are using those guys to temporarily fill you up, all while hoping they can offer you more eventually. Holding to standards is tough. It means saying no for higher vision. It means saying no to the experiences you have been saying yes to. It means saying no because you love yourself MORE than the connection. That’s where the deeper work with your therapist comes in. That’s where strengthening your self-esteem and self-love from the INSIDE (instead of the outside – i.e. men) comes in and fills that void. So it’s less about being “guarded” and more about making choices that align with what you really want. It’s more about having standards and not negotiating away those standards. This is a tough one, I’m not gonna lie. It took me years of deep work to finally be able to say no to guys and source my own power and self esteem. I had a TON of trauma though.

Does this makes sense?

Heidi

[Heidi G]

Hi Christina,

Thank you for sharing your story! It is sooooo incredibly difficult to feel like you aren’t on the same page. It’s actually one of the biggest challenges many “couples” face as they navigate getting to know each other.

How often do you guys get to see each other? And when you do get together, is it typically for a few days?

Have you guys ever had an argument? I’m wondering what his darker side is like. Do you have any idea? Do you know his past relationship history?

Honestly, this “project” is just an excuse. I’m not doubting that it takes up a lot of his time, however there are PLENTY of guys who are still able to make time for their woman. The truth is, when a guy really wants something, he goes after it. So whenever I hear a guy use work as an excuse, then there are 1 of 2 things happening. 1. he is a workaholic which means he will NEVER be available for an intimate close relationship because work will ALWAYS win or 2. he is using it as an excuse to keep some distance. Now don’t get me wrong here…of course there are seasons where work can be more busy, but whatever this project is, when it’s done…there will just be another project to work on. Most guys are NOT aware enough about themselves to even know it’s a way they are creating distance, so it’s difficult to even have a conversation about it.

So my question to you is, do you know if he is a workaholic? How many hours and days a week does he work? When he is with you, is he still working or do you get his FULL attention?

I know he checks all the good things on your list, but does he check the negative things as well? By that I mean….it doesn’t matter how great things are when they are good, because if he is not safe when he or you are under stress, then it’s a relationship that will never feel safe and be sustainable. Do you know what he is like when he is super stressed? Do you know what he is like when he is angry?

I’m bringing this up, because if you don’t even know these sides to him, it might be a good idea to slow down and vet him more before really trying to invest in this guy. I know things feel amazing when you guys are together, but that the easy stuff and very far from knowing whether a relationship is workable, sustainable, and healthy.

Thoughts?

Heidi

[Heidi G]

Awwww! I am sooooo so sorry you had to go through this! I know how scary it feels, but the truth is…it’s actually a GREAT thing that it happened. You were your limited, uncontrolled self and he got to be right next to you and help you through that. Someone who is going to be that “forever” kind of person, HAS to see all sides of us and love us anyways.

The thing is Anna, when looking for a person to to go through life with and invite into your inner circle, sacred space where your heart lives, the person you want needs to be able to love and accept ALL of you…panic attacks included. If he cannot handle that side of you with compassion and acceptance, then he is NOT the guy for you. AND…whatever his worst traits are, you need to be able to love and accept that side of him as well. Deal breakers are INCREDIBLY important to know and find out about. If he has a pattern of treating you terribly when he is under stress, then that is a deal breaker. If he cannot accept that you have panic attacks sometimes, that is a deal breaker. So you are learning about each other and finding out whether or not you both can handle stress together…or not. Do you see why this is an important thing to discover? Do you see the gift in your panic attack in front of him?

The way you handle this is by loving yourself Anna. If you can love your limitations, then it invites other people into loving you in those times as well. So moving forward, I suggest to have confidence and own it. He will respect that so much more than you being embarrassed and apologetic. So you can say something like “Wow…I really was shocked that happened at dinner. I have panic attacks every once in a while, but you know what? I’m ready to really start exploring where this is coming from. It’s so uncomfortable and I’m ready to learn about it more….” And have a plan ready about how you want to approach this. Obviously, this statement needs to be true and I imagine it is. I imagine you would like to be able to get control of your emotions, yes? So why not tackle this head on and do something about it. Learn about it, master it, own it. A man is truly attracted to a woman who can take care of herself. He wants to feel secure and peaceful knowing that she knows how to handle herself. Men respect that. Men want to be with women like that. Men open their hearts more to women who take care of themselves and do not rely on them to make sure they are happy.

Does this make sense?

Heidi

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