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Thanks for sharing more details! Let’s break this down a little more. Let’s REALLY talk about this discussion you want to have with him before you do it.
I’m kind, I’m tolerant, I’m loyal, I’m faithful, I’m loving, and I am very altruistic when it comes to the people I love. I’ve been told that’s not necessarily enough, but what is enough? What a great question!!! There actually is no such thing as “enough.” Meaning, what is enough for each person and relationship varies. The couple has to decide what is enough or not enough. It doesn’t matter though, because ultimately, the ONLY place that “enough” matters is your relationship with yourself. You could be doing everything right for the relationship and your partner could still walk away. Was it because you weren’t enough? That’s not the right question to ask. Relationships are 3 components. You, them, and the relationship. You could love the other person but not love the relationship. You could feel love for the other person but actually not love yourself in the relationship. It is sooooo layered and complicated that reducing it down to “am I enough” doesn’t offer a clear picture. What matters is that you feel and know “I am enough” even if this person doesn’t choose you. “I am enough” even if this person rejects me. “I am enough” even if this person doesn’t fight for me. “I am enough” even if this person tells me I’m not enough. The goal here ALWAYS is to define your self worth, your value, your lovability through higher levels of truth and NOT through someone else. If you allow someone else to decide your value through their choices or their words, you become fragile, dependent, insecure, and fearful. When someone rejects you, the biggest gift they are giving you, is an opportunity to strengthen your self-esteem. Every single time I am rejected by a guy, a friend, a boss, a co-worker….yes, it hurts…yes, my low self-esteem gets activated, but because I have a lot of high self-esteem, I am able to quickly pull that in and remind myself…”I am enough” even if this person doesn’t feel that way about me. So whether you are enough or not needs to be defined by YOU and NOT someone else. Does this make sense?
I kind of made the decision that if this didn’t work I’d rather be alone for a while, but I’m not sure I’m ready to be alone. My kids are all leaving home and I don’t want to be all by myself. How about NOT making decisions until they are right in front you? Just take 1 day at a time and explore what is happening for you. Trust that when you need to make a different decision, it will be presented to you and you can say yes or no.
Let’s look into the “alone” thing. What are you so afraid of? Your desire to NOT be alone is not a reason to be connected to someone. You are going to have to face the empty nesting that every mom goes through and if you try and avoid it by being with a guy, you are just going to be bringing the unresolved feelings into the relationship with you. What are you most of afraid of about being alone? What do you think will happen? What are you afraid to feel?
But when I told my boyfriend about it he basically told me to block him, and I’m not supposed to care that he’s going to the hospital, that seems to be a doubles standard. I’m going to be very strong here. I agree with him. You got away from this guy because you suspected him being sexually involved with your children. He SHOULD NOT, ON ANY LEVEL, be connecting with you. He is NOT safe. It’s not about NOT caring that he is in hospital, but you have broken up, he is toxic, he is not safe and yet you are still choosing to allow him into your life? You are protecting your children from him, but not yourself? Block him!!! He is not a safe person for you to be connecting with on any level!!! What is happening to him in his life is not longer a concern of yours. It doesn’t matter if your current guy is having a double standard. It’s MUCH easier to see someone else clearly compared to yourself. Look at you…you see his situation clearly, yet here you are, doing EXACTLY what he is doing…staying connected and available to an ex who treated you poorly and caused a lot of harm. I know you are not talking to your ex like he is, but your ex still has access to you and you are allowing it. GET AWAY FROM YOUR EX AND NEVER TALK TO HIM AGAIN!!!!! He is dangerous! DO NOT let him pull you back into his world on any level!!! STAY AWAY!!!
Either way is time for a pretty deep discussion with him What are you wanting to talk about? What are you hoping to accomplish with this conversation?
Where it leaves us, I believe will be the way it’s meant to be. Anything can change at any time. Where it leaves you will only be for the moment. You are always changing and so is he….especially in ways neither of you are aware of.
Whether or not I’ll find a man that isn’t a jerk is questionable. First, your guy is not a jerk. He is just wounded. He is doing the very best that he knows how and so are you. Does that mean his best is healthy for you? No. Sometimes the best we can do still causes harm and it’s our job to wake up to that and shift it….but many don’t. It’s just not how they think or how they operate in the world and that’s okay. They are absolutely allowed to move through life in whatever way they want. They are not bad people. They are just limited and wounded. Your guy has a lot of really beautiful qualities and you would not be fighting for this connection with him if he didn’t. It’s more a questions of whether or not this connection is healthy and able to function at the level that YOU are looking for.
I’m honestly not sure I even want to anymore. It’s a hard thing to even decide, if I’m going to try again I mean There is nothing to decide here. Right now, all you need to focus on is what is happening in front of you TODAY. What do you want TODAY? And if what he is offering is not enough, you can choose to adjust your needs or ask for more from him. It’s your choice. Either choice will take you down a path that will bring you to another choice point and you will decide again what path you want to take. That is how life works. Trying to decide now, what you want even a month from now, is unrealistic as you don’t know what will happen between now and a month down the road. So stick with the choices you have TODAY.
And as far as him lending her money for the divorce, is still was inappropriate. He was doing it from a place of wanting to rescue her and NOT in a healthy way, but in a co-dependent, low self-esteem “I want her to like me and value me” kind of way. Making decisions from a place of fear, low self-esteem, anxiety etc. bring toxicity into the decision. It’s NOT about the decision itself, it’s about WHY someone is making a decision. For example, you deciding you want to be with this guy partly because you don’t want to be alone means fear is driving you towards him. It’s not a clear energy. It’s an energy that will muck things up. Does this make sense?
I know I am throwing a lot at you. If it’s too much, just ask me to slow down or break it down even further. Question me, challenge me, ask me to explain further, tell me what is NOT helpful. Anything you feel or need, tell me. That’s part of you strengthening your voice. Your opinion and how you are feeling matters to me, so bring it all out! This is a safe space and I will receive all of it!
Heidi
Hi Lori! Welcome! Thank you for being here and sharing your situation. It’s very layered and there is a lot more to consider than you realize. Let’s see if we can find a clear path forward for you.
He thinks she is narcissistic and will never date her again, but unfortunately I am pretty sure she still has his heart and the only reason he won’t date her again is because of how much she hurt him when they were dating. First, there is no way that she has his “heart.” What she has is his attention. Love does not exist with a narcissist. Anyone attracted to a narcissist is more trauma bonding and NOT actually connecting through the heart. Think about it this way….what kind of person is drawn to someone who treats them bad? Can you actually love someone who treats you poorly? Can you actually love someone who you don’t feel safe with? The connection they feel with that person who treats them poorly is NOT love, it’s NOT authentic attraction, it’s NOT high functioning. What it is, is a person who is used to be treated poorly (usually beginning in childhood) and so they are attracted to someone who supports what their system is used to. This is no different than a little girl who grows up with an alcoholic parent and being abused and neglected, choosing a partner who is also an alcoholic. There is a TON of unresolved trauma energy running in their system and so the partner they choose matches that trauma energy. It FEELS like there is strong, authentic connection, but it’s actually a very unhealthy addiction. So you have to consider….what is going on with HIM that he is calling her his “best friend,” helping her financially with her divorce, calling her a narcissist, was treated poorly – and he still can’t stop talking about her? BIG RED FLAG here. He is quite wounded, has A LOT of low self-esteem, and is not even aware of how unhealthy this relationship with her is and how much his wounded energy is driving him to stay connected with her.
I know I haven’t activated his “hero instinct” and I am pretty sure the reason he is still stuck on his ex is just that, the fact that she has needed him so much.. It’s not that simple. As I explained above, the connection he has with her is coming from his unresolved pain from his past and the “hero instinct” is just a small piece of how it’s being expressed. His need to feel like a “hero” in the way that he does, is excessive and unhealthy.
What can I do to fix this if I don’t really need anything? Let’s talk about you for a second. I understand you are independent. But you can be independent AND “need” him at the same time. Instead of viewing the hero instinct as “needing” him per se, view it as a way that you are creating opportunities for him to be his very best self and for you to be in a state of receiving. I would say that is that hardest part for women…to be in a state of receiving – especially single moms. Single moms are constantly in a state of providing, always thinking about everyone else except themselves. Well, here is a guy that LOVES to rescue (a little too much actually) but he would be great practice for you! For example, you don’t “need” him to carry in the groceries, but you could easily say “Hey! I would really really love your help with carrying in the groceries. Would you mind grabbing a few bags?” And then make sure you super appreciate him after by giving him a kiss and telling him how much you love that you can ask him for help. There are a million small moments where he can be involved in your life, helping you, even though you can do it all yourself. Does this make a little more sense?
He has helped her financially with her divorce Yikes! This is NOT okay. He only dated her for a short time and him helping her financially with something like this is incredibly unhealthy and inappropriate….especially considering how bad she treated him when they were dating. The fact that he was drawn into this with her, just tells me how addicted he is to helping and how much she is using his co-dependent behavior. He is helping someone who doesn’t truly value or respect him. This is a very toxic pattern.
What am I doing wrong? I’d like to offer you another way to look at relationships. Instead of thinking “right” or “wrong” think of it as just a learning experience. Yes, you could do better at inviting him to participate in your life more AND you are dealing with a guy who is more interested in being treated poorly than being with someone who is more peaceful for him. So there is nothing “wrong” here…there is just learning and trying understand what’s happening beneath the surface.
Let me explain this a little further. It’s a very layered concept and I usually teach this in a class format with drawings, but I’ll see if I can explain it here. There is a thing called the “Upper Limit.” It’s the limit we each have that determines how happy we are allowed to feel. The smaller the limit, the less we are able to tolerate feeling happy. The determining factor of how happy we each can be, is directly tied to the amount of low self-esteem we carry. That low self-esteem is established in childhood and grows and grows and grows into adulthood and until our last breath…unless we do something about it. I used to have a TON TON TON of low self-esteem when it came to men, so all I was attracted to were the “bad boy” type of guys who were completely emotionally unavailable. I didn’t believe I deserved any better. Also, it was like a drug. Every time I did get the attention of that “bad boy” it was like I was getting this shot of self-esteem and it would make me feel “I finally am worth it. I finally am lovable. I finally am worth paying attention to.” My father was a narcissist, so he set up this pattern for me. I tried to like the nice guys. I would last about 2 weeks on average before I got “bored” and ended things. So in essence, my upper limit allowed me to feel happy, nourished, well taken care of for 2 weeks. Yikes! I have spent MANY years clearing out my baggage, and in the process, strengthening my self-esteem. Now, there is no way you could pay me to even talk to a “bad boy.” I have no interest whatsoever, but that’s only because I cleared out a lot of my baggage that kept my upper limit so low. You know that you or someone else is reaching their upper limit because they will start to sabotage their happiness in some way. It comes out in a million different ways and they never realize what they are actually doing. All they are doing is following how they feel, but they don’t actually understand that their feelings are coming from a really dark, painful place…not a clear, high functioning place. Sabotage can look like losing interest, picking small fights, starting to find things wrong with the connection, slowly pulling away and becoming unavailable, becoming attracted to someone else etc. And while they do those things because it’s how they feel, most people don’t understand they are actually sabotaging something that is really healthy for them. Does this make sense?
Part of me thinks I should approach this more as a friends with benefits situation in order to guard my heart, but the other part of me just wants to help him let her go and start feeling for me that way. I can’t change the way he feels and I know he won’t go back to her, but because he says he sees real potential in a long term relationship, but he just doesn’t feel it in his heart yet, should I just wait? I am very confused.. I’ll be straight up here. There are 2 main things to consider here.
1. Who he is: you barely know the guy and he already is putting up walls. He is staying in a relationship with a woman he feels is a narcissist and treated him poorly and he brings her into your relationship by talking about her a lot. She is his “best friend.” What does that say about the kind of guy he is?
2. Who YOU are choosing: What is happening within YOU that you would start to tie yourself to a guy that clearly is confused. He says he wants a long term relationship, but his actions are NOT 100% in alignment with that. You KNOW and can FEEL that he is not really available and that this other woman is playing a big role in that. So in essence, this guy is not emotionally available for you…or anyone else for that matter. So YOU are choosing to go on the same type of journey your guy is on. Your guy is staying connected to an emotionally unavailable woman and you are staying connected to him, who is also emotionally unavailable. You both are functioning in the same exact pattern, just in a bit of a different way.
Don’t you want a guy who has NOTHING stopping him from wanting to be with you? Don’t you want to connect with a man who says he wants a deeper relationship and he acts like it too? Relationships are incredibly complicated. Being VERY clear about wanting to be with each other, especially in the very beginning, should not be part of the complication. Personally, if a guy has even a little question as to whether he wants to be with me or not, I’m out. I’m not interested AT ALL in exchanging my energy, my time, my feelings, my vulnerability with a guy who doesn’t know, through and through, the value that I bring to his life. That just tells me he is either not ready for me, or we are not the right fit for each other and I have learned over the years to truly listen and honor that instead of trying to change it. It might be painful sometimes, but it’s much less painful than trying to make someone work that is going to cause me deeper pain the longer I stay in it.
Thoughts?
Heidi
Wow. I’m impressed at how clear you have become and how much you are willing to fight for yourself. You are definitely ready to make a shift and expand your relationship with yourself and with love.
I definitely want to fall madly in love and have a healthy relationship We ALL want this. The thing is, it means different things to different people. So I’m going to suggest and exercise for you. This exercise is fluid. Meaning, what is true for you today WILL change as you get older and will change as you change and grow.
It’s the ONLY list I recommend following when it comes to choosing a partner. I call it the non-negotiable list. These are the qualities that are NON-NEGOTIABLE for you in a relationship. These are qualities that are REQUIRED for YOU SPECIFICALLY if you are going to flourish in a relationship. They truly are non-negotiable. So if you have a list of 20 things let’s say….if you meet a guy who has 18 of those 20, IT WILL NOT WORK. EVERY SINGLE QUALITY MUST BE PRESENT in the relationship in order for it to work. Once you have your list, it will be your guiding light as you date. The reality is, no matter how healthy you are, how much you love yourself, how much emotional intelligence you have, for women specifically…we are DRAWN to connection in such powerful ways because it just how we are built. That connection will easily cause us to lower our standards. I have found myself MANY times questioning my non-negotiables because I met a guy who was missing something, but he also had SO MANY other things, that I wanted to make to it work….even though I knew better. So while you say this: I am affirming I deserve love that is safe, consistent, and reciprocated. no exceptions! expect that you will be drawn to emotionally unavailable men again and you probably will try and make it work again. And that’s okay! It’s normal…it’s all part of growth and expansion…and you will learn different lessons. Being strongly connected to your non-negotiable list will help you be much more clear about what you are stepping into. Meaning…if one of those qualities is romance, and you come across a guy who is NOT romantic, but he has other amazing qualities, you probably will still step into it thinking…”well…maybe I don’t really need romance. Maybe over time he might start to show more of it. He has so many other great qualities, maybe it can really work….” I can’t tell you how many times I have this type of conversation with myself…100% knowing what I am doing, aware of the consequences, aware of the outcome…and yet I still stepped into that relationship. My need to connect and have an adventure was much stronger than aligning with my non-negotiables 100%. But again…it’s OKAY!!! It’s part of your journey and I guarantee you will learn more about yourself, so it’s never a waste of time.
Here are some examples of my non-negotiables:
1. romantic
2. loves animals / especially dogs (I do a lot of dog sitting and they are crucial to my balance and well being)
3. high emotional intelligence
4. active – loves hiking, being outdoors, exercising
5. respectful when arguingThese are just a few things I require. These are elements that MUST exist in our connection if I am going to have a high functioning, healthy, and nourishing love that will continue to grow.
It’s super important for you to understand the details of your list. For example, when I was younger and a super athlete, I wanted another athlete. But then, as I tested it out, I dated a guy who was just active…he didn’t play any particular sport, he just lifted and would hike etc. and I learned that an athlete was not required…I just wanted someone who was active. Every single thing on your non-negotiable list should be tested out and explored on the dating journey. Does all of this make sense?
This list is about what you cannot live without, NOT everything you want to have in a relationship. There is a BIG difference.
One way to start is to look at what YOU require in your life in order to keep your balance. For me, it’s being active, outside, with dogs, learning and reading and growing within myself and feeding my spiritual/emotional side. These are just a few things. If I am going to have a deeply intimate and vulnerable relationship with a man, he needs to love those things within himself too…they are organic to him and NOT something that takes effort…these are things that are inherent to his well being as well.Is this making sense?
There also is a fundamental thing that is important to understand about relationships in general. The place relationships break is in the worst of each other. Meaning….it’s how people treat each other in their worst moments where the foundation breaks…where trust and safety are broken over and over and over again. And eventually, the relationship becomes un-repairable.
So when I date, the very first thing I am looking for is how they treat people under stress and how they treat themselves. If they are disrespectful, unaware, critical, abusive, stonewalling or anything that is harmful, I don’t care how amazing the guy is…it will never last. I REQUIRE to be treated with respect, even in the most stressful times.
We ALL have coping mechanisms that get activated, so it’s learning what those are in someone and seeing if it’s something you feel safe with. Obviously, if a guy gets super angry in his stressful, triggered response and becomes critical or verbally abusive, run for the hills! This is also a place for you to work on within yourself. While I require respect, I also give it. I never ask for something from someone, I am not able to offer myself. So developing your skills to manage your stressful emotions is SUPER important if you are ever going to be a healthy partner for anyone. I require this from ALL my close friends and anyone who is involved in my life. But the thing is, it’s not anything I ever have to have a conversation about. Every single person lives that way on their own. It’s just how they function. So when we have disagreements, they are respectful and very high functioning. Honest, authentic, we each own our part in the situation, we talk about what we need different in the future…AND sometimes it might get heated, but the words are never abusive or critical. Respectful means neither person is causing harm.
So some of the questions I ask in the beginning of dating to see this part of someone are things like:
1. Tell me about your biggest heartbreak. What did you do?
2. What is the most hurtful thing that has ever happened to you? What did you do?
3. What are you like when you are angry?
4. What is the biggest hurt you have caused to someone else?Questions along this line where you are asking about the hardest part of life are IMPERATIVE to truly getting to know someone that you are considering letting into your life. For me personally, I ask these questions if I am starting to feel like I am bonding and might have a hard time letting go. One time, I even went as far as testing a guy. We had a date scheduled and I wanted to see if his ACTIONS matched what he told me about how he handled stress. So when he came to pick me up, I made him wait 30 minutes because I was “late.” Then as we are almost to the restaurant, I pretend panicked saying I left my curling on and we had to go back so there wasn’t a fire. That caused us to miss dinner completely because we had tickets for a gallery event after that we had to go to. We get to the gallery and I “accidentally” spill my champagne all over him. Then after that, I give him a little break but as I see that he is in mid conversation with someone he is really enjoying, I go up to him and tell him that I am not feeling well and need to go home. So basically, I POUNDED him with moments where things just were not going well. Nothing significant or meaningful at all, just a lot of annoyances and the energy of discord. As it turns out, he was not what he said he was. He turned into a complete ass in the way of having no compassion, no ability to laugh or joke about the mishaps, he stopped communicating and mainly just projected this seriously irritated energy the entire ride home. He withdrew 100% and didn’t even walk me to my door once home. If that is how he responded to stressors that are just annoyances and not that big of a deal compared to REAL stressors, then I sure as heck had no interest in moving forward with him. He actually never reached out again after that. We had been on several dates, talked very deep and were really bonding and then this night happened and I never heard from him again. As much as it hurt, I was sooooooo glad to have learned this about him sooner than later.
Do you understand what I am getting at?
I guess not wanting to start over, and not wanting to be alone. This is definitely something to explore. This is a very common fear and will drive people into toxic connections all the time. I always tell people….one of the most important skills to develop in order to be a very powerful partner, is to be alone. No dating, no flirting, no nothing. The first time I went through this, is was sooooo painful and unsolicited actually. I had moved to Knoxville Tennessee and it was the first time in my life that I was not getting any attention. I was used to people always looking at me. I was used to guys flirting with me. I was used to have a very filled little black book for whatever I wanted. Then in Knoxville, it was completely silent. I felt anonymous for the first time in my life. Then one day, I felt this question come up…how do I know that I am a woman if men don’t let me know? I had soooooo intertwined my femininity with the energy that men were constantly sending my way. I knew this was a really big question and stepping into that journey would change me in a way that I deeply wanted. It took about 3 years, but emerging on the other side offered me a level of knowing myself and feeling empowered in a way that I had never felt before. I dated completely different after that. I was able to adhere to my standards so much more easily. I attracted a very different kind of guy. Mostly, I became much more solid and self loving. It was everything I had ever wanted, but man…it was a tough season.
That’s the reality of transformation. You have to step into your greatest fears and find out the why, the what, the how…and shift those fears from the inside out. It’s not an easy journey at all, which is why most people don’t take it. But the result is freedom, empowerment, self-trust, self-love….and those results are things no one can ever take away from you.
When I write out what I want versus what I’m getting it makes me upset and I just really can’t justify it anymore. Good! You need to be upset because it wasn’t working. Neither of you are at fault here….you both just have different needs…and the pain is supposed to increase to let you know that it’s time to leave. Pain is one of the greatest motivators for growth.
The last time I did it for him to make him change, but this time I did it for me, and it doesn’t hurt like it did before. He understood and it was peaceful. I love that this was peaceful. How healing! It sounds like you BOTH just accepted what is, and while it may hurt…it’s okay. That is true respect. That is true caring for each other.
I thank you for your words because it gave me that final push needed to do what needed to be done and for the first time in my life I’m choosing me and letting go of a man that is a great guy but cannot meet my needs in this present moment. I am so happy that what I shared was helpful for you! You were ready and are ready to make some deeper changes within.
Looking forward to your response.
Heidi
Hi Angela,
Thank you for sharing your story. There is a lot going on here…many layers to this very complicated situation.
What is your understanding about why he feels he cannot commit? What does commitment mean to him? Failure? Prison? Loss of freedom? Obviously, he feels like he is going to lose something if he commits and he is not ready to lose it. Do you know what that is?
Since you have done a lot of healing work so far, I will dive right in and be a bit more blunt and bold. If it’s too much, just let me know. I can cause someone to feel overwhelm sometimes or cause them to shut down because I went beyond their capacity, so just be open and honest about what works and doesn’t work with what I share. It’s incredibly tricky trying coach very complicated concepts through this platform.
I believe that it’s not all him and that I can leave him and will still have an issue with men committing to me ( as this is a pattern) until I heal whatever is going on internally. I can see why you would come to this conclusion, but I’d like to give you a different way to look at this. The reality is, what makes a man commit has to do with MANY things. So this pattern of men NOT committing to you, has less to do with you specifically and more to do with what lives within them. I would say that the pattern, or what needs to be healed within you, is the pattern of you saying yes to a man who is not available. Every time you allow a man to enter into your personal, sacred space and you KNOW he is not emotionally available for you to the level you are wanting, you are betraying yourself, right? That’s the core root issue here that needs to be healed. It’s about your relationship with yourself. You keep wanting men to choose you, when they are not capable of doing that…for whatever reason. It’s the “wanting” them to choose you that is the key to exploring this pattern.
Here is a question to really work with, that may help you understand this better. What are you wanting HIM to do for you that you are not willing to do for yourself? So this current guy….you want HIM to choose you, but in reality, you are not even choosing you. If you really were choosing yourself, you would not be involved with him at all. He cannot offer you what you want…plain and simple. It’s clear to you, yet you keep going back to him. So YOU are not choosing you. And so you want HIM to choose you instead.
I work with this concept in relationships….never ask someone to do something or be something that you are not able to do or be yourself. I like to use the analogy of Swiss cheese. We ALL have solid parts and we all have holes. Most people walk around looking for someone to fill their holes. This obviously becomes a very toxic pattern, right? It is no one else’s job to fill our holes. That’s our job. So this brings me back to the question….what hole are you wanting HIM to fill within you, that you are not willing to fill yourself? Does this make sense?
And I firmly believe having negative or limiting beliefs about him, us , or love period will not help me no matter who I’m with. Let me ask this. Is it REALLY a negative or limiting belief by saying “I want a deeply connective, committed type of love that will continue to grow and expand. He is not able to offer that to me right now.”
What I see A LOT of women do, is constantly try and shift or change their needs, their standards, what they want….so they can stay connected with their guy. It seems like you might be doing this. Yes? No?
Your situation, from the little you have shared, seems quite straight forward. You want something from him that he is not able to offer. He may WANT to offer it, but his fear is getting in the way. So…for who he is today, he cannot give you what you want. So in order to stay connected to him, you have to keep negotiating away what you want and need. If you were to REALLY adhere to what you wanted, you would not stay connected to him. This type of pattern, if you dig deep enough, you would find a part of you that is sooooooo strong and ALSO fearful to fall madly and deeply in love. The truth is, if you REALLY wanted to fall madly in love, then you would find someone who is available to take that journey with you – you would not be negotiating away your desires. But instead, you have tied yourself to a man who has some serious limits. You keep getting mad at HIM for his choices, but the truth is – you are the one choosing him and NOT accepting him for who he wants to be. HIS choices are limiting your ability to feel that deep, committed kind of love and YOUR choice to stay is ALSO limiting your ability to feel that deep, committed love. But…you keep getting mad at him and you want HIM to change. That is not where your power lies. Your power lies within. YOU need to change. YOU need to shift how you treat yourself. YOU need to explore what is causing you to sabotage your heart’s desire of falling madly in love. You need to explore where the fear lives within you when it comes to love and relationships.
Okay…I’m going to stop there, as I feel like I have said quite a bit already. Looking forward to your response.
Heidi
Hi Sam,
Thank you for being honest with how you feel. I’m so sorry you are having to go through this. It is incredibly painful and upsetting and stripping.
I’m sorry I overwhelmed you. Being on this platform can be quite the dance in figuring out how much a person can take, when I hardly know them. Some people really just want it straight up and some need a more gentle approach. It sounds like I missed the mark with you and sent you into overwhelm and that is not my intention. My goal is to always help someone get connected to the truth of their situation instead of letting their desire to get out of pain be their guide. Whenever pain is high and when being faced with loss, people want to “fix” their situation so they don’t have to hurt anymore. My goal and my job as a coach, is to help you look at the facts and whether or not those facts are changeable, fixable, and a healthy endeavor to undertake. But again, my attempt at helping you connect to the facts of your situation, seem to have put you in overwhelm and I’m sorry about that.
With that being said, it sounds like although you are hurting deeply, you are able to face the facts that he is not willing to grow or change – and that is all you need to know that your situation is not fixable at this point in time.
I am here to keep talking with you Sam. Ask your questions, challenge my perspective, ask for ideas on how to heal…I have a lot of experience dealing with the worst of life. I am here to encourage you and support you in any way that I can.
Heidi
Hi Sam,
Yes this was all very hard to read and it has upset me but I’m taking everything on board and I appreciate everything thank you. Of course this was upsetting to hear. What you are going through is so incredibly difficult. Your dreams that you have built about your life are falling apart and you want to fix it…and I’m telling you it’s not fixable until he gets some help. Your heart is breaking and I am telling you that it cannot be repaired in the way you are thinking it can repaired. I am so so sorry Sam. Your heartbreak is valid and scary and is leaving you in so much unknown territory and that is so incredibly uncomfortable. You are strong Sam. The fact that you can even hear and be open to what I am saying says a TON about the self esteem, strength, and interest you have in truth. There is A LOT within you that can help carry you through this very unknown territory and you will absolutely come out the other side much stronger, wiser, empowered, and emotionally intelligent.
I can see it in our bank account and I have stopped myself from looking because it upsets me greatly.I feel awful even sharing this. No need to feel awful for sharing this. Of course you are upset about this! I have no judgment towards either of you. I just have pure compassion for the pain and misery he is carrying and I have compassion for the resentment and anger you feel for his choice to stay in this addiction. Anybody in your position would be upset and struggle. Anyone who is in a relationship with an addict feels EXACTLY the way you do…so kick that shame to curb for sharing this and give yourself some space and validation for feeling how you do.
I’ve been carrying around and thinking that he didn’t want me or find me attractive anymore. Our communication is so terrible isn’t it? Yes, your communication is struggling, but that is normal with an addict. They have an internal world that is theirs and theirs alone – so communication is not on the list of things to care about. Remember, he is in survival mode and has been there for decades and will only get worse over time. Communicating with you means he would have to be open and honest about his darker feelings too and that is just not something any addict is ever willing to do until they are ready to get some help. And let’s face it…any guy, even an open and honest guy would have trouble talking about having no libido. It’s such a private and personal thing that is wrapped around the core of a man’s identity. That’s a tough one! I’m glad you finally learned about this!!
Which hurt me so much because I have been working so hard to build my business to where it is today and hopefully one day retire him and make him proud of me. I’m curious…what is your business? Well done for working so hard. It sounds like you have turned your business into something successful! That is NOT an easy feat these days.
I want to highlight your statement that you wanted to make him proud of you. This has the flavor of co-dependence. I don’t know if this is a pattern of yours, but it’s a common trait for people who choose addicts or emotionally unavailable men. Co dependence means “Meeting the needs of others at the expense of your own.” Now this in and of itself is not a bad thing as there are times where our needs to go on the back burner….the problem begins when this becomes a pattern and the dominant way of functioning in your relationship. So being married to an addict means their needs are the most important and will always take precedence over anyone else’s. Their survival, their feelings, their desires all revolve around the substance – so what YOU need is not as important as what they need. In order for you to stay in the relationship, you HAVE to reject your needs all the time. You are meeting HIS needs at the expense of your own…and as long as you function that way, the relationship can sustain….but it’s an unhealthy and toxic relationship. Eventually it breaks, like you are now experiencing. It doesn’t make you or him bad or wrong, it just means that the pattern you both operated under, can’t work anymore. And that’s to be expected considering the circumstances.
I am seriously LOVING everything you are doing for yourself. Even though this separation is incredibly painful, you are meeting yourself for the first time in ages. You are getting to focus on yourself, get your needs met, and NOT having to deal with a very depressed and angry and rejecting guy walking through your door every day. You get to have some peace which is crucial to having clarity for your next steps. One step at a time right now Sam. Good job taking care of yourself!!!
When he left he said that he doesn’t have a life and he wants to concentrate on him, earn a load of money buy investment properties and buy a boat and live on the river. This was the first time I had ever HEARD these things. And it’s so stupid because I want all of those things too!! He doesn’t have any mates and just works. I have tried so hard to do different things with him and he just makes himself unavailable. Okay…I’m going to say something very hard for you to hear, but it’s important that you operate from a place of truth and shatter any fantasies you have built around him.
The reason why you have never heard any of this is because you were never part of the picture. This “dream life” he has created in his mind never included you. The thing about an addict who doesn’t want help or to change, is they WANT to be alone with their substance. They don’t want anyone to see their habits, nag them about their choices, or mirror back to them the damage they are doing. Addicts LOVE LOVE LOVE to be in isolation. It’s just them and their substance and that’s all that matters. That’s why he just wants to make a lot of money, have no friends, be alone and live on a boat. He gets to just drink and smoke to his heart’s content and no one can tell him otherwise. Listen…the level of pain he is carrying is massive and drinking and smoking is his escape and his way of “numbing” and staying in denial. It’s his way of surviving. We all have survival mechanisms, but unfortunately his is causing a lot of damage.
I have to try and accept this and keep moving forward even though deep down I want him back. That is the hardest thing to accept and hurts me to my core. Let’s really break this down. Do you REALLY want him back? Do you REALLY want to go back to being rejected every single day when he walks through the door? Do you REALLY want to be in a marriage where you are left alone to figure things out – even something as small as fixing your table? Do you REALLY want to be with a guy who chooses alcohol over you and will never change that? Do you REALLY want to be with a man who makes you feel anonymous?
I think what you want to hold onto is the best version of him. You feel in love with the good parts too and it’s THAT side of him you want back. Unfortunately, his darker side is a deal breaker. So saying goodbye to him means saying goodbye to the best parts of him too. You tried and tried and tried to be “different” for him and it didn’t work. You were trying because you were wanting to build a happy life with him and you are saying goodbye to that idea as well. You are having to accept that the worst of him is not workable anymore. It’s time to let go of the dream Sam.
Heidi
Hi Sam,
Welcome! Thank you for your vulnerability and sharing your story. It is a very complicated and layered experience you are having, so let’s see if we can dive in and help bring higher level truths into your situation so you can move forward with much more clarity.
I just have a few questions first:
1. What was the reason he got a divorce the first time around?
2. How long has he been an alcoholic and smoking?
3. Does he even admit to being an alcoholic or does he feel it’s not damaging because he is high functioning and not abusive?
4. When he said he would quit, do you think it was for you or was he wanting to quit for himself?Okay…I’m going to play a bit of a devil’s advocate here with some of what you are believing about your situation. It’s meant to help you expand your thinking and understanding of the situation and to generate conversation and more questions from you.
I was having this whole internal dialogue with myself that he chose beer over me. BUT he wasn’t! He has a very high-pressure job and just needed to decompress and have a moment to himself. I see it so clearly now! In my opinion, he was choosing alcohol over you. All addicts choose their substances over connection and relationship. All addicts use substances to manage their stressors, whether it’s their job or family life or their pain from the past etc. But let’s go a little deeper into this. He doesn’t have the ability to choose you, because he doesn’t even choose himself. He is running away from his stressors. And by that I mean he is constantly managing his stressors with alcohol and cigarettes, because he is not willing to face the pain, the anger, the hurt…..basically all the stuff he has buried over the years. So because he isn’t willing to look at all of that baggage he is carrying around and he would rather drink and smoke to manage it, he is not choosing to love himself. He is in constant rejection of himself. Meaning…he is constantly rejecting his darker feelings. So if he can’t even take care of himself and his darker feelings and deal with them in a healthy way, there is no way in the world he would be able to handle yours. And this is why he doesn’t have the ability to choose you. This is why he is choosing alcohol over you. It’s not because he has a stressful job…there are plenty of people who have stressful jobs that are not addicts. He is an unhappy person because of a life long habit of burying his pain from whatever happened in his life and as he gets older, that baggage he is carrying will only get heavier so he will need to increase his drinking and smoking to continue to manage it.
I’m saying all of this because while your lack of a happy demeanor inspired him to stay downstairs, your anger resentment is NOT the main reason he is leaving. He is leaving because that is who he is. He has years of abandoning himself and leaving himself – meaning he avoids dealing with the hard part of life – so he eventually will always leave a relationship. He does not have the skills nor the capacity to deal with the hard part of life.
And I also want to add…I don’t know a single person who would not have become angry for having an absent spouse. You felt how you felt for good reason. You would not be human if you didn’t feel that pain of his daily rejection. He is an addict Sam. Addicts are unavailable and horrible at relationships and that is why there are support groups for the partners and family of addicts…it’s impossible to have a healthy, nurturing connection with an addict, especially if they are not getting help.
I’m not saying your attitude didn’t contribute to breakup, but your attitude is not the core problem here. You could get him back Sam and shift your attitude and be open and loving and accepting, but it will not change that he is an addict and it will not change that he avoids the hard part of life, and it will not change how much he rejects you and the relationship. It is not just YOUR job to nurture the relationship. It’s his job too and you picked a man who doesn’t even take care of himself, so he sure as heck can’t take of your feelings – especially the hard ones.
Now….it is not unusual for men to need to their alone time when under high stress. It’s a common way that they deal with things, but there is a balance to that. If he were healthy and more emotionally available, he would walk in the door, kiss you and say hello, and say “I love you and I will be back up in 30 minutes and available to talk to you.” That takes all of 2 minutes to do to make sure you are connected with and to make sure you get your needs met and then he gets his needs met. It’s NOT your responsibility to make sure he always has a happy home to come back to so he wants to hang out. That is NOT realistic and that is not life. Life is a rollercoaster, so just as you are believing he has the right to have his alone time, you ALSO have the right to feel how you do. Relationships are about talking through ALL of it and coming to a deeper understanding of each other. The thing is, he is not available for you to do that with…and THAT is the core problem hear, not your lack of being your cheery, happy self.
I’m spending every minute I have while I’m not at work, working on myself and learning how to be a better be a better me and show him the person that he fell in love with. I love love love that you are learning about yourself and seeing the areas where you were lacking. Well done. I’m curious, what are doing? Reading books? Have you ever considered working with an expert?
I want to clarify here. I’m not blaming this breakup on him. It is always something that happens because of how BOTH people feel and how BOTH people are behaving. I believe that almost anything is repairable but ONLY if both people come to table and talk about everything. It seems that you are operating under this idea that if you were somehow better, happier, more bubbly, more cheerful, that you wouldn’t have ended up in this place – and it’s THIS belief that I wanted to address. The reason there is an ending is because of him too. So while you are learning about yourself and learning how you could have been a better partner, if he is not interested in coming to the table with the same mindset, willingness to learn, willing to be held accountable, willing to make changes…then there is no relationship. You cannot be the only one here wanting to fix this connection, learning, and growing. I guarantee you, you could get him back and make all your amazing changes, but you would end up right back here, separated and grieving the loss of him, because he did not work on becoming a better partner. Addicts HAVE TO deal with their addiction first before ever being available for a relationship. Their true commitment, their true love, their deepest and strongest relationship is ALWAYS the substance and until that shifts, you and your kids will always be second to his alcohol and cigarettes – which means anyone in his life will be second…and it will only get worse as time goes on. It NEVER gets better until he faces it and commits to changing.
So honestly, the question here is Sam, are you willing to fully accept that you want to be with an addict? Are you willing to fully accept that he will ALWAYS choose his alone time, his alcohol, and his cigarettes over you? Are you willing to feel rejected every single day, even though you are more cheerful and happy to be around? Are you willing to fully accept that a lot of your needs are NOT going to be met?
What I suggest is that while you are learning about yourself right now, also learn about the realities of what it’s like to be in relationship with an addict. And look up “high functioning” as those experiences will be more similar to yours. These are the toughest situations, because they are high functioning, so the consequences appear to be much less damaging…all you are dealing with is daily rejection and not being abused, he is not dangerous, he is present and helpful sometimes etc. But I want to encourage you to still learn about how damaging it can still be. It’s important for you to get a realistic picture about what you are trying to fight for.
I also want you to research “avoidant” attachment style. Also research emotionally unavailable men and relationships. The reality is, even if he were not an addict, I would be saying the same exact thing. The very hard truth is, if 1 partner is emotionally unavailable, not willing to work on themselves, not willing to talk things through, not willing to be a partner through the hard parts of relationship…then it will NEVER be a happy, nourishing, healthy connection. It’s impossible. You have to have BOTH people putting in the effort.
I’ll end with this. It’s obvious he loves you. It’s obvious he is deeply connected to you. It’s obvious he deeply cares about you. I can see why you would want to be keep fighting for this. I sure don’t blame you and I’m not saying that you shouldn’t. What I am trying to do here is to ground you in the reality of your situation. You changing is NOT enough for this marriage to work. It would work for a period of time, but then it would break again at some point and you would be right back here – believing that if you just had been different, if you just had been better, then he would have stayed. And while there is a thread of truth in that, the BIGGER truth is, the marriage is breaking because of his addiction – and that is not something YOU can fix. That is his choice to make.
Okay…so I have no doubt this was hard to read and possibly upset you. Let’s keep talking about this. What questions do you have? What are you having a hard time accepting? Is there anything I may have misunderstood?
Please be patient with me. Trying to deal with a VERY complicated situation through writing is limiting. There are many many nuances that are missed when not being able to talk in person, so I just ask for your patience and understanding.
Heidi
Hi Julia!
I wanted to check in. How are you feeling? Has anything new happened with your guy? Give me an update and any thoughts or questions you might have about what I shared.
Heidi
Hi Julia,
Welcome! I am sooooo so sorry for the hard time you are having. It is heartbreaking to watch someone you deeply connect with, slip through your fingers and there is nothing you can do about it. It’s called powerlessness…and that feeling is what causes sooooooo many people to slip into depression, obsession, suicide, meanness etc. Powerlessness is THE hardest feeling to deal with. My heart goes out to you that you are having to feel all of this.
I’m wondering, do you have access to a therapist or coach or anything? It sounds like you would really benefit from having support from an expert. I will help as much as I can, but the type of pain and the desperateness you are feeling and even wanting to not live anymore sometimes…those are some VERY deep feelings that you need to learn to work with – because this will NOT be the last time you feel this way. I’ve been where you are and I got help and it was the smartest and best decision I have ever made. You are so young and have sooooooo much life ahead of you and I would hate to see you throw it all away because of these intense emotions that are controlling you.
I’ll just explain a bit to you and offer some ideas of how to work with them and maybe it will help.
It’s first VERY important to understand that you have stories connected to these feelings. Your feelings are NOT the facts. They are just feelings associated with a story that your mind made up. We ALL do it. When something challenging happens, our brains cannot help but make up a story like “He doesn’t love me. What’s wrong with me” or “I must have done something wrong.” “I’m not enough.” “Life is not worth living anymore”. These are all short stories that can show up when an event happens. The thing is, NONE of these short stories are based on facts. They are based on YOUR PERCEPTION. You could take 1,000 people and have them go through the same EXACT situation you are going through now, and there would be 1,000 different reactions. So again…emotions are NOT facts. They are perceptions created by your specific filter or lens that formed since you were born. And these stories are controlling your well being. These stories are SOOOOOOO powerful and full of so many lies, but the hardest part is separating yourself from those lies and start to bombard yourself with TRUTH. What’s the truth? You are worth loving and knowing even if this guy doesn’t think so. You absolutely can and will be okay even if this guy never comes back to you. This pain is only temporary and you have laughter and happiness waiting for you on the other side of it. Your broken heart CAN heal. You are MORE POWERFUL and so much more than this pain, than this rejection, than this heartbreak, than this loss. YOU ARE MORE than all of it. These feelings visit us in life every once in a while and will poke holes in our self-esteem. These challenges are always gifts showing us where we are incomplete, where the lies live in our system that create the low self-esteem, where we lose ourselves in other people.
The thing is Julia, the core problem here is NOT that he has disconnected. The core problem here is that you have no idea who you are, your strength, your value, your worth, your beauty…you don’t know any of that WITHOUT this guy. That means you are putting all your value into this guy and now that he is rejecting a connection with you, you have lost yourself. You won’t go home because it’s “too lonely” so you stay at your mom’s house. You stayed in a toxic relationship for a long time and you even continued to allow him to stay with you even after breaking up….all so you don’t have feel that “emptiness” that “loneliness” that “quietness.” The reality is Julia, you cannot spend the rest of your life trying to fill it with people so that you know you are okay and valued. You will have a VERY miserable life that way and it only gets worse as you age.
The reality of life is….YOU ARE POWERLESS to have what you want all the time. That means, rejection is waiting around the corner and at any given moment, your life will fall apart. You might get fired, you might lose someone to death, your heart will get broken from a best friend or another boyfriend and the list is ENDLESS. Life has many ways to shake things up and if you don’t start to learn RIGHT NOW how to deal with the worst of life in a healthy way, you will fall apart again and again and again and keep living in suffering and that is an awful way to live….I know this firsthand. There is another way Julia, but you have to fight for yourself. Instead of looking to HIM to make you feel better, what if you made yourself feel better all on your own? What if you learned how to heal WITHOUT needing him to come back to you. Waiting around for him to come back so you don’t have to hurt anymore is giving him ALL your power…meaning you are relying 100% on HIM for your happiness and well being. You are being a victim. I’ve been there many times until I learned there is another way. I fought hard and learned how to forgive, learned how to accept people’s choices that harmed me, learned how to heal even when those people never apologized or fought for me, learned how to find my happy even when life was challenging, learned how to find my own value without needing anyone else to show me or tell me that I’m valuable. It took a lot of work and a lot of help from experts, but now….I am incredibly strong, I am empowered, I am resilient, I am intelligent, and I deeply love myself, no matter who is rejecting me. I know that I can handle ALL the curve balls of life because I have an incredibly strong foundation of trust and truth constantly running in my system. I began my journey when I was your age because of a broken heart and I want to encourage you to do the same.
You are stronger than you think!
I know you want him back, but to be honest, whatever it is that he is going through is a lot and it sounds like trying to take care of his connection with you is something he doesn’t have the capacity for. He is in survival mode Julia and anyone in survival mode is NOT available to take care of a connection very well. Also, men and women view and experience relationship VERY differently and you are seeing the differences right now. Women absolutely tend to want to connect MORE when stress is high. Men tend to want to disconnect and go into their “caves” and be alone so they can “think” about things. This dynamic is VERY painful for the woman because it’s completely opposite of what they would do. Regardless, it’s so important for the woman to let their guy do what they need to do. Trying to get him back right now Julia might be more harmful for him than good. I know it doesn’t make sense right now, but can you trust that he is doing what he thinks is best for himself right now? Can you let him figure out how he needs to survive without trying to figure out how to keep you happy? Would you be willing to give him space right now?
Heidi
Hi Palesa,
I thought I’d check in and see if you had any thoughts about what I said or to see if you had any other questions. Would love to hear back from you!
Heidi
Hi Palesa!
Welcome! You have a really question and there are a lot of layers to work through, as there is no one “correct” answer. The right answer is really about you and your standards, regardless of him. So let’s see if we can find some clarity for your situation.
First, I have A LOT of questions about a guy who is 57 and never having been in love before. Was the mother of his child a one night stand or something? Second, I also have some concerns that he has no idea how to treat a lady who wouldn’t have sex with him. To me, HIS standards are telling you a lot about him. If you put the 2 together, never having been in love and expecting to easily sleep with women – he is set up to have more surface and casual experiences and does NOT know how to have more deep, vulnerable connections with a woman. Even him “warning” you that he once had a woman who turned into a friend due to a lack of sexual interaction is telling me that this guy equates connection with sex and he has no idea how to TRULY access a woman’s heart. That “warning” was a purely male perspective with very LITTLE understanding of the female heart. And while he says he doesn’t want to pressure you, that statement was 100% pressure and he knows it. He’s been at this game a long time and I guarantee he has a lot of tactics up his sleeve to get a woman into bed. And being that you have said no (good job) he gets to have a challenge.
Just from the things you have shared, it’s pretty obvious this guy doesn’t really know how to be intimate with a woman – he is the type to move fast and stay on the surface and there is no mistake in that…it’s very intentional for him. Whatever his reasons are for setting interactions up like that with women, don’t really matter. What DOES matter is that he doesn’t even know how to be with a woman without sex involved and develop the relationship outside of the bedroom. For a guy who is 57, BIG RED FLAG.
I hate to say this, but it’s possible he has a sex addiction. Even though he is not having sex with you, it’s possible he is having sex with other women in the meantime, while still keeping you on the hook. And considering how he relates to women, it does line up with that type of addiction. But who knows. I know for me, I personally would have my boundaries up EXTRA strong until I really understood about what was going on beneath the surface for this guy. My guess is, his interest won’t last much longer considering his pattern. And that has nothing to do with you!
Even that fact that you feel you might have “overshared” because of telling him your typical experiences with me, tells me there is something about this guy that doesn’t make you feel comfortable opening up and being authentic. Sharing something like that is NOT an overshare. It’s normal and pretty typical and it’s not that deep. It’s also possible that you felt you overshared because you are not used to being a little vulnerable too. I don’t know.
So you have to REALLY think about how you want to be treated. What are your standards beyond having no sex? That’s where the true foundation is established for any relationship. It’s been 6 weeks and he hasn’t been asking you out on dates. He has been texting you daily, but is that REALLY how you want to be treated?
Here is an analogy I like to share. Imagine you are the owner and CEO of your company. Your company is your heart…your vulnerabilities, your thoughts, your love, your insecurities, your greatness….ALL of you. And you are looking to hire someone to help you run your company. This person is going to be INTIMATELY involved. It’s a high level position in your company, therefore there are special skills and experience required in order to handle your heart properly. Dating is the interview process. You are interviewing the guy to see if he has the proper skillset. For high level positions in ANY company, they look for certain skillsets, management styles, critical thinking, problem solving skills etc. So if you look at this guy from this perspective, would you say he is qualified for the job? Does he has the skillset, the motivation, the management style, the ability to handle being at a super high level position for your company??
From what you have shared so far, no way. He has never even been in love, so that in and of itself tells me he doesn’t even have the experience. Also, that fact that it’s been 6 weeks and you are wondering how YOU are supposed to proceed, tells me you are not acting like the CEO of your company. Your heart is SACRED. It’s valuable, it’s precious, it’s one of a kind and you are trying to figure out how to move forward with a guy who clearly has no clue how to be with you without sex? Your standards need to go far beyond no sex. Your standards need to align with how you expect to be treated as a person. Your standards to need to just as strong and expectant as if you were a CEO of a company looking to hire someone for a very high level position. So with that in mind, what are your thoughts on this?
Heidi
Hi Sharry! Great question. How about you share some details about your situation, so we can offer more customized guidance.
What is happening in your relationship with him that makes you need to use this? Do you understand why he has disconnected? Why do you feel this 12 word text approach will work? What are you going to ask him for help with?
Heidi
Hi PJ,
Sounds like this guy is quite slippery and I know how confusing that can be. He is saying one thing, but doing another. And while what he says is pretty great, he is not taking ACTION on what he is claiming to feel about you.
Honestly, I want to guide you towards letting this guy go. He doesn’t have integrity in his words. For him to be talking with you about having a LT relationship while not having asked you on a date yet…and for him to ask you out a few times and then not following through…you has already broken trust and safety and the relationship hasn’t even started yet. It makes me wonder the other ways this gets expressed in his life. If it’s actually THIS HARD to even start a relationship, then imagine what it would be like to get him to show up on a consistent basis. If he has panic attacks and anxiety, then that tells you that he has a VERY STRONG relationship with fear. And that fear will absolutely ALWAYS win over love, over showing up, over anything he needs to face. If his fear is THAT strong that he can’t even follow through on showing up for a date with you, then you are going to be more in relationship with his fear, than you are with him. You are truly looking at a VERY HIGH MAINTENANCE relationship with this guy. Imagine what happens when you are annoying him, or upset with him, or you do something that hurts his feelings…do you really thing he is going to be open and honest about his feelings? This guy will most likely bury his feelings until one day, he explodes because he cannot contain all his feelings anymore and you will get blasted with years of pent up feelings. Remember, he can’t even follow through on going on a date with you and you think that he has the skills and ability to handle tough feelings that require communication and confrontation??? I doubt it.
And also, you were NOT juggling 2 guys. This current guy is NOT invested in you. He is staying connected but at a distance, yet you are already investing in him and giving him access to your heart, even to the point of ending things with another guy who I’m guessing was actually showing up in person with you.
Your heart is so sacred and so special Pj. Don’t give it away to a guy who doesn’t have the ability to truly take care of it.
Thoughts on all of this?
Heidi
Hi Janeen!
Thank you for sharing your story and validating Rebecca’s experiences as well. I’m glad you have chosen to get some help with your situation!
Men and women operate sooooo differently in relationships, don’t they? It’s soooooo common for women to come across as “needy” and men to come across as “avoiding” and while those are true, to me it is a reflection of our core, instinctive nature. I don’t know a woman alive who wouldn’t head into a “needy” state when their man pulls away. It’s sooooo awful for us because at our very core, instinctive nature, we are the relationship caretakers. You can take everything away from us and we would be okay, but if you take relationships away from us, that is where we will fall apart. That is part of why the woman typically takes care of the children and the family unit. She makes sure everyone’s needs are met, she makes sure she knows the teachers, the neighbors, the coaches, all the people involved in their kid’s life (obviously I’m generalizing here as many moms do not operate this way). For men though, their core focus is in their ability to produce. They NEED to produce something in this world. You can take everything away from a man and he will be okay, but taking away his ability to produce in his life will mean that he falls apart. For example, a guy who is the stay at home parent will make sure his kids are okay AND eventually he will start to find projects around the house to fix or something to make to ensure his core, deep, instinctive needs are met. Typically, the man doesn’t think about getting to know teachers and neighbors and all that, because it just not how they think. I can’t tell you how many guys I dated in my younger years that were AWFUL in relationship as soon as they lost their job and didn’t know what was going to happen next.
My point in sharing this, is to expect to be needy when your guy pulls away. That is a very natural response AND…it’s also super important to manage that feeling in a way that doesn’t cause damage or push your guy away. The neediness is definitely a trigger for a guy to put walls up even more. I really love how you have already recognized this and owned your reaction 100%. Well done! The goal here is for you to regain and re-connect with your confidence WITHOUT him. Meaning, finding your center…finding your power…finding your confidence and value EVEN WHEN he pulls away. This will not be the last time he does this, so it’s a good time to practice learning how NOT to lose yourself when he decides to pull away. This is super tough but one of the most valuable skills that I teach my clients. Here is the one question we usually work with….What do you want HIM to do for you, that you are not willing to do for yourself? For example, when he pulled away and your obsession got triggered, you were chasing after him because you wanted HIM to make you feel better. You wanted HIM to help you get out of this pain of feeling disconnected and separated from him. You wanted HIM to confirm that you were not losing him. In summary, you wanted HIM to connect with you, so you didn’t have the feel the pain of the disconnection that was happening. Basically, this is a very disempowered way to get your needs met. Your well being is reliant on HIM instead of having the skillset to take care of your own needs when he is not able to. So this is where you learn how to connect to yourself. You were hurting which turned into obsessive behaviors. Hurt requires compassion and care and that was what you were wanting from him. So how can you give that to yourself instead? What are 5 ways that you can be compassionate and caring towards yourself that is hurting. An easy way to find these answers is by imagining that part of you that is hurting, is a small child. If you were the parent of the small child hurting, what would you do to help them?
I always suggest 2 ways that involve other people and 3 ways that do not involve other people. This way, when others are NOT available to you for some reason in that moment, you still have a skillset to be able to help yourself. For example, some ways that I personally comfort myself is I create a spa day for myself. I’ll take a shower and use my very favorite (and occasional) sugar scrub that has a calming eucalyptus scent to it. I will put on a face mask, I will lotion up my feet and put on super soft socks, I will make my very favorite tea, and I will watch a super light, fluffy, feel good movie. Another thing I do is I will go to the dog park. Dogs, for me, are incredibly helpful. They are playful, silly, friendly, present being that can shift my mood in heartbeat. Another thing I do is I will get out my mandala coloring book and start to color. One skills I teach people is called the Left/Right handwriting technique. Imagine your dominant hand is your adult you and your non dominant hand is your little you, holding all the hurt feelings. I pull out some big paper and my big crayons (sometimes my glitter pens because that is what my little girls feels like writing with) and I have a conversation with her. My adult (right hand) says “I can feel your sadness. I am so sorry that you are hurting. I would love to hear about it. What would you like to tell me.” and then my little girl (left hand) picks up her glitter pen and starts to write what she wants to tell me. It’s fascinating because it truly feels like a child writing with your non-dominant hand. And so we end up having a conversation. The one rule is though…NO FIXING OR SOLVING THE PROBLEM. We have a tendency to want to fix those feelings, but always remember you are dealing with child mentality. What a child needs MOST is just comfort. They need a hug, they need to be validated, they need to be listened to, they need to feel connected. THAT’S IT!!! So as the adult, that is your ONLY job in that conversation. Does this make sense?
Hope all of this helps!
Heidi
