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Hi Anne,
Thank you for sharing more details! Guilt is a very strong block for intimacy. If you like believing the way you believe, then maybe it is better for you to find someone like-minded, as this particular area for you guys, will wreak havoc on the relationship. If you are interested in having a more expanded mindset about sex, then he can be a good experience for you, if he is willing to go slow. Letting go of beliefs and paradigms that you have lived with your whole life, is like stripping your identity. It’s not easy and requires compassion and patience.
Sex IS an important part in the average male’s life. It is a driving factor them and in the forefront of their minds over 90% of the time. That’s normal. It’s just how they were made. It’s a big challenge for many men to learn to control their desires instead of their desires controlling them. It’s a lot of work for them. For women, we need them to value the relationship and connection more than sex. It’s a very, very layered and dynamic way that we experience each other. I’m also wondering if he is taking anything like Viagra. It would be normal for someone at his age, especially being a single guy. That could also increase his libido.
Either way, what is CRUCIAL for you to be clear in your communication. I would say something like, “Listen…I have not freed myself from the Catholic views on sex. I am willing to look at it and explore more within myself. I am interested in growing and discovering more in this area, but it will take time and patience as I explore this area of my life. I understand your desires as well. I don’t know where exploring this area will take or how things will shift or not shift. I may discover that I don’t want to change my viewpoint. I don’t know. So let’s just take this one day at a time.”
And use him as a resource! It sounds like he went through this process of letting go of beliefs and creating new ones. Ask him about that. Ask him why, how and what his current viewpoints are and why those are his viewpoints. He will LOVE those questions because he will see you are making effort, which builds trust, and you will get to know him better in this area, therefore building trust for you.
There is a possibility here, where you feel like sex is REALLY important for him, because it isn’t to you. Your experience with that side of your life is pretty limited. Having sex from behind or against the wall are positions that I would call “normal” in the scheme of things. Erotic would start to head more into unusual positions, toys, games etc. If you want a more clear perspective on this, just google erotic sex and see what comes up. So someone like him comes along and his sexual experiences are much more expansive and it feels really big for you, when in reality, his sexual desires might be more in the normal range. I don’t know, as I’m obviously not there. I just want you to consider that your perspective about this area of HIS life and how much he values it, is being seen through a lens that has a much smaller / limited viewpoint. That’s why I suggest talking to him about it, so you can learn about HIS perspective and how he experiences his sexuality.
Lastly, one of the way I began to expand my life sexually, was I studied it. I read books, I talked to all kinds of people, I ordered teaching videos etc. It’s a beautiful area of a relationship that is so sacred and beautiful and deserves attention. There are soooooo many differences between men and women in this area, so it’s important to learn about yourself first and also explore a man’s viewpoint. A movie that I found helpful for me was called the “Kinsey Report.” It’s about Kinsey, who was the first person to really study sexuality in men and women. I found the movie helpful because although it was all about sex and what he studied and learned about it, there was a science undertone throughout the whole thing. It felt less like a “sex” movie and more like a good education for me at the time. Just throwing out ideas. Something like that movie may be too much for you at this point, I don’t know.
Hopefully some of these suggestions are helpful for you as you begin a journey in this area of your life.
Heidi
Hi Carmen,
Thank you for more clarity! Okay…so you DO want a relationship with him. How long ago did you guys decide to enter into this FWB zone? Before heading down the relationship path with him, I would encourage you to start to get to know him from a “relationship” perspective. Meaning, you have not been in a committed relationship with him since you were a teenager, so this is a side to him you really don’t know about. The first thing I am wondering, is what is his idea of a committed relationship? It sounds like he might have some thick walls around his heart. He will never get married again, he wants to hang out and be in relationship with you, but he also wants to do his own thing. So it sounds like a design where he keeps you at arms length all the time. Do you know where all of that comes from?
I know you don’t want to “mess this up.” I want you to make sure however, that how he functions in a relationship will nourish you, support you, make you feel emotionally safe and that he is someone you can really grow with. It’s pointless to try to get him to commit to you if he is an emotionally unavailable kind of guy. You would end up being miserable!
Lastly, I also want to encourage you to face your fears, low self esteem, need to control etc. We all have that kind of stuff in us. As a Dating Coach, I ALWAYS ALWAYS encourage my clients to be alone for awhile and NOT date so they can face all the boredom, anxiety, desperation that shows up. It’s so important to learn to love our life alone without a man. You learn to take care of all of those emotions that come up all on your own. You learn to be happy and peaceful and create a fun life, by yourself. Which means…you don’t need a man to make you happy or feel good about yourself. Reality is, until you deal with all of those things you feel when you are alone, they will ALWAYS be there and sabotage any relationship you are in. All those feelings don’t go away once you are with a guy, they just get buried and then rear their ugly heads in various ways and cause relationships to fail. So you really are interested in having a sustainable relationship, it means facing yourself and all those intense feelings.
Thoughts?
Heidi
Hi Keysha,
Thank you for writing in and sharing your story with us!
I just have a few questions. You say you have been in love with him for 30 years. Did you guys have an affair as well? Has he ever expressed having romantic feelings with you? What has been your relationship with him over the 30 years? You guys remained just friends and kept in touch every once in awhile? Does he reach out to you and initiate contact or are you the one always reaching out?
I want to caution you with this man. I understand you have strong feelings for him. Does it not bother you that he is a cheater? Do you realize that if he were with you, he the odds of him cheating on you are VERY HIGH?? He would rather break his integrity than to be honest and authentic and communicate with the woman he is with. And it also sounds like he NEEDS a woman to be around. So when one relationship ends, he will hop right back into another relationship. He sounds like the kind of guy who uses women for whatever he needs. I would venture to guess that he is someone who isn’t capable of deep, authentic, intimate love. How well do you REALLY know him? I’m wondering if you have a belief that if you were his woman, he would be different because you would love him so much, he would never want to cheat and he would be happy with you. Is this how you are thinking?
Looking forward to more details!!!
Heidi
Hi Tracy,
I know how difficult this time is for you. Growing and expanding is usually very uncomfortable. It’s challenging because hurt is usually associated with growth and expansion.
I think you are doing a doing a great job! You are not texting him, you are giving him space and you are taking one day at a time. You say you are working on yourself. I would love to hear what you are doing. What kinds of things are saying or doing for yourself to connect more to yourself? What are you doing for self love? Are you learning about what does work and what doesn’t work for you? I think it’s really helpful to share these details as it can help the other ladies here on the forum to see what you are doing for yourself. Self love is one of the most difficult areas to strengthen. Everyone wants the other person to make them feel better. Making yourself feel better, without the help of the person who is causing the pain, is just plain difficult….HOWEVER, very possible and healthiest path to take. The moment you give someone else the authority to make you feel better, you give away your power. It’s actually the very lazy way to “heal.” It’s making him do all the work instead of you doing it yourself. Even after all of these years that I have known this and know how to take care of myself, I STILL want to be lazy and feel better by someone else saying or doing what I need so that I can feel better. So I’m proud of you for even just talking about this concept. Many people reject the concept right from the beginning. It’s a start to even just consider learning how to take care of your own emotional health. Yes, it is difficult and challenging, but the rewards you get from it are priceless! One MAIN reward you will get, is a healthier relationship. I know you want that!!!
Heidi
Hi Carmen,
Welcome!!! We are glad you are here talking with us.
I’m a little confused about this, so I just have a few questions. He wants to be committed but you don’t….why? What is stopping you from being a relationship with him? It sounds like you are getting what you want from him. Some texting, occasional hangouts and booty calls when you want them. I’m wondering why you feel you need “magic phrases?”
Let’s address you “fail miserably” at relationships. I wish there were magic phrases for everything, but reality, it’s not something you want to rely on. You want to have the strength to use your own words and be yourself. That is what it means to be authentic in a relationship. What will better suit you, is to really work on those parts of you that are insecure or sabotage connection. Magic phrases cannot fix something like that. It’s like putting a bandaid over a huge cut that needs stitches. It can help for a bit, but it won’t last.
So why don’t you share with us, what your challenges are in a relationship. What do you believe about yourself that is causing you to fail at relationship?
Heidi
Hi Anne,
Thank you for writing in and sharing your thoughts with us!
I’m wondering if he mentioned what exact sexual positions he was wanting to try. Did he say specifically or did he just ask a general question about trying “different sexual positions?”
Here is the thing about sex. We ALL have a lot of different perspectives and experiences according to what we were exposed to. Religions shape our perspectives about sex, school and our peers shape our perspectives, our parents, what we see in the media and magazines etc. So I want to ask you this…you have your perspective and experience about sex and he has his. I think the main limiting factor here, is it seems that you think that his perspective is “erotic” and not appropriate, when in reality, it’s just a different way to experience sexual intimacy. It sounds like he has more freedom to experiment and enjoy the many ways to experience intimacy than you do. It’s actually quite normal for people to try all different kinds of positions with each other. Sex is a VERY dynamic and layered and expansive way to experience your partner. If you just stay in one position every single time, for years on end, then it’s easy for the sexual aspect of the relationship to become boring and stale. There are different aspect of a relationship that need to be fed and nurtured. There is the friendship, there is the sexual intimacy, there is the growth and planning and creating visions together, there is the communication etc….ALL these areas feed into the health of the relationship, sex included. Sex IS an important aspect for a man. Being at his age, it definitely hold less power and value, but it still is an important part of the relationship. What he is asking for, is quite normal and common.
However, being that you both just had sex for the first time, this is an uncharted territory for you guys, so there is still a lot to learn about each other in this area. It takes time. He can say all he wants that he will be with you regardless, but he doesn’t know and neither do you, if you are sexually compatible. You just opened that door and it is going to take time and patience AND a willingness to grow in this area of your lives, if the relationship is going to be sustainable.
Are you willing to consider trying something new? It doesn’t have to be right away. You guys can get to know each other for awhile sexually, at the comfort level you are at. After trust is built and comfort has been established, THEN you can start to try something new that you never have before.
This is a great way to get to know yourself! My first suggestion for you is to look at what has shaped your perception about sex. Religion, parents, media etc.? How have you come to the belief that “proper” sex is what is appropriate and nothing else? Explore this topic for yourself and look at the possibility of re-shaping those beliefs into something new.
Is that something you are willing to do?Heidi
Hi Tan,
Thank you for sharing more details. I’m glad he is being open with you about not being good with money. I wonder how he is surviving right now…if he doesn’t have a job, who is helping him to live his life? Where is he getting money from to eat, pay rent etc.?
I would say that it is pretty unrealistic to expect to see him anytime soon. If he has no money and no job, how is he going to “scrape” some money together for a flight? That would be him, spending money on a plan ticket that he shouldn’t be spending money on. He needs to get his life in order, get a job and start to take care of himself. Spending money on a plane ticket to come visit you is a luxury and he cannot and should not be doing something like that right now. Besides, if he were to come visit, you would also have to pay for everything, because I can’t imagine he would have the money to pay for his own food. Were you planning on him staying with you at your house?
He can be a wonderful supportive man emotionally, but he also needs to be able to support himself, just like you are able to do. For a man especially, it is VERY difficult not to be able to “provide” for himself and especially for his lady.
I would suggest to just let this relationship happen how it happens, but also open the door to new possibilities.
You are correct in that you guys live in a bubble. You have created this whole relationship based on conversation, which is such a small percentage of reality. There needs to be a plan to take your relationship further and make that happen OR you can remain “dating” but not committed. You can keep your options open.
How does that make you feel?
HeidiHi Susan,
I am so so sorry for what you guys have to go through. Facing death is so incredibly difficult.
First, I want to suggest to not get wrapped up in “pitty.” Instead, keep connected to the truth about the situation. Your children will be okay. You will be okay and so will their father. You all will get through the loss of him together. It will be an adjustment, lots of tears and moments of depression, but it’s all a part of life we have to face and accept and deal with.
Why not just have a straight up conversation with him? You can say something like, “I’m sorry you are dealing with this again. I want to help you through all of this. Who knows how much time is left and it doesn’t matter. I say we put all of our differences behind us and just spend the remaining time with each other in peace and appreciation for the life that is left. I want our family to be in the same room together and create some wonderful memories. It will be very hard when you go. Let’s make the most of it while you are here. What do you think about that?”
Can you say something to this effect to him?
HeidiThis is actually a really good question!
I want to ask you a question in return. Why do you want to “make” a man love you? You said you have plenty of men who are interested in you. Wouldn’t you rather be with a guy where you don’t have to work so hard for his attention? Relationships are soooooo much more fun that way!
Imagine having a relationship with a guy who is inspired by you, just because of who you are. He knows you are the best thing that has ever happened to him. He knows he wants to spend every single day with you and talk with you, hang out and laugh, create memories together. There is NOTHING stopping him from wanting to get to know you and be with you and fall in love with you. Isn’t that what you want? Don’t you want it to be natural for a man to feel this way about you instead of having to use “psychology tricks” or trying to change a guy?
Let’s look at this from a different perspective as well. If you think about it, when you spend all of this energy to try to get a guy’s attention, trying to use tricks to get a man to love you, all you are thinking about is yourself. You are not thinking about what HE needs, what is good for HIM and it doesn’t matter to you whatever it is that he feels about you….you are only thinking about yourself and getting what you want from him. You basically want what you want, which is for him to fall in love with you and help you with your career, and that is what you care about….yourself only. What about him and what he feels? Don’t his feelings matter? Don’t his needs matter? The guys probably spends 90% of his life with people wanting something from him. His money, his connections, his power, his sex appeal, his fame. I’m sure he craves to be around people who actually know him and like him for who he really is….his quirks, his humanness, his messiness, his wonderful little habits that make him unique etc. Truth is, you have no idea who he is and whether or not you actually like him because you have spent so little time together. You have very little information about him, yet you want him to fall in love with you because you want to use him for your career and whatever else he can offer to enhance your life. You, of course, have every right to take that approach and live your life that way. But something tells me that you are interested in a deeper experience with a man. Yes??
Yes, a guy’s intention ALWAYS matters. Yes, there are ways that can work (it depends on the situation) that can shift how a guy feels, but bottom line, it is so crucial to RESPECT how someone feels and behaves, whether or not you agree with it or like it. Having respect for how they feel, means that you ACCEPT who they are and not try to change them. That is one of the most important things to remember always. Every single person on this earth deserves to be cared for and respected for their choices and how they feel. Basically, you are wanting this guy to love you and meet your needs, because you won’t do it for yourself. It’s YOUR job to love you, not his.
There is a lot to say on this subject, so I’ll stop there and let you think about all of this. We will keep talking, as this is a GREAT subject you brought up. A lot of people struggle with the same thing.
Heidi
Hi Heather,
I’m glad to hear you have a lot of patience. I do want to caution you. I understand you both have an instant, effortless connection with each other, which feels so wonderful! You are doing a great thing by being patient and letting him decide the pace of everything.
The caution is about his lack of communication. It’s very important that actions and words line up. Yes, some people say things but do not do things….it sounds like your guy does things, but doesn’t say much. That can be just as much of an issue in relationship. Actions AND words need to exist in a relationship. Communication is always the top 1 or 2 reasons for divorce, so being comfortable with using words is CRUCIAL to the success of a relationship. I’m can see where you would get wrapped up in all the wonderful things he does for you and how he treats you, but I guarantee over time, your soul will crave words from him as well. Having the strength to say what you think and feel at any given time, is part of what it means to be authentic. Imagine being in a relationship with a guy who doesn’t talk much. He may show you how he feels by doing things, but you actually don’t hear it very often and you actually don’t hear a lot of thoughts….therefore you really don’t know him very well. This could go on for years!!!
I’m not saying at all that you shouldn’t pursue this with him, I’m just wanting you to go into it with open eyes and be aware of the potential of the challenges you face.
Have you ever read “The 5 Love Languages?” I think that might help you understand him better as well and also understand yourself and your needs. https://www.5lovelanguages.com/
Heidi
Absolutely! Whenever ANYONE says anything about the future, it’s good for that moment and that’s about it, because anything can happen. I’m sure he felt that way when he was saying it, but it sounds like sooooo many things have become stressful for him, that you don’t matter anymore. Men are particularly unreliable when their work life becomes a mess. I have experienced this over and over and over again…a great connection, everything going well and then something happens with their work and they become distant, distracted and completely unavailable. That’s when I leave. I need to honor them and know they have things to take care of and I need to honor myself by saying NO to being ignored, stood up, feeling like the last thing on their mind. There is a lot of science behind why this happens with men and their jobs, but I won’t get into that now.
This is not about him though. This is about you allowing yourself to be fighting for a guy who is not available. Maybe someday when things settle down, he will be available. If he wants to connect with you, he will.
You need to go live your life and value yourself enough to not be treated this way. You are abandoning yourself to a fantasy and not accepting who he is right now. You keep holding onto what he WAS, but it’s not longer true. What he said in December is no longer true. It was true for that moment and I’m sure he had the best of intentions, but it’s not true now and that is what you have to deal with. The future is uncertain. So your job is to live your fullest life possible NOW and that means letting this guy go. Your focus on him is preventing you from living your life. Once you let go, you will begin to see a much bigger world out there! If he ever wants to get you back at some point, then he has to make the effort and reach out…plain and simple. And when a guy wants something, he will go after it. By setting standards and expecting to be treated a certain a way, you will attract a guy who aligns with that. This guy does not.
Does this make sense?
Heidi
Hi Ana!
Wow! It usually is not that easy! lol. I’m so glad you were able to connect into the truth about the situation. I just want to warn you….don’t be surprised if you get drawn back into him and wanting him back. It can be a super rollercoaster ride when trying to separate from someone you thought was “the one.” Maybe you won’t go through that, but if you do….don’t be surprised. It’s a process to let go of a dream you created around someone.
So now that you have connected more to yourself, tell us more about how you feel about yourself? You abandoned yourself so you could connect with this guy. Is this a pattern of yours?
Heidi
Hi Sharon!
Great to hear from you again! I’m so glad to hear that you are connecting deeper with yourself. It sounds like you found a good “happy spot” when he returned from Dubai. Well done with you sticking to your plans and not re-arranging your life for him!!!
As far as that group, they can be sooooo helpful! It’s much more than people sharing their feelings. What happens with groups is people admitting to their struggles, having support for those struggles, being validated and seen AND being held accountable. In groups, you don’t really get to hide (if your committed to participating). You allow people to see you and your deepest struggles while everyone else is doing the same. It can be really powerful if the group leader is a good one and group feels like a good fit. I would suggest to give it a shot for at least 2 months. Get past all of your resistance and go. Sometimes that resistance is a way to sabotage your growth. If you give it a good run and still feel it’s pointless and not doing much for you, then you can maybe find another group that feels like a better fit or try a different direction.
My guess is, the polyamory thing might have scared him a bit. Even though you aren’t pushing his boundaries and respecting whatever it is that he wants, he still has to deal with the idea that you are someone that is comfortable for that. It’s tough for a guy to imagine the women he is with, having sex with anyone but him. Since a sex party is something you are comfortable with and he isn’t, he is going to have judgements about that…towards himself and towards you about what that means. Then you invited him to a pool party with people from that circle. Even thought it wasn’t a sex party, there is still going to be that vibe. I personally would not have wanted to go either, being that I would know that most of the people there have had sex with each other, which means there is a unique underlying bond between the people, there could be people that would be looking at me and thinking that I might be a new “prospect”, it’s a pool party which means people with a polyamorous viewpoint are walking around half naked which makes the sexual energy higher AND I would also wonder (if I were your date) how many of these people you had slept with already (not so fun for a guy to be meeting a bunch of people his girl has been with). It’s not like going to just any ol’ party. So, I’m guessing he might have had some of those types of feelings and didn’t want to own up to it. He needed to be honest with you. Can you understand that despite the invitation saying it was not a sex party, how he still might be uncomfortable and feel like it still might be too sexual for him?
Did he apologize for bailing on lunch with you???
It sounds like he is really pulling away. How do you feel about just being very direct and saying “Listen, I don’t know what has happened. We are no longer connecting and it’s obvious something has changed for you. Are you willing to just have a conversation about it and clear the air? Let’s both just be upfront and get back on the same page, whether it’s together or it’s time to create an ending.”
How does that make you feel?
Heidi
Hi Renee,
Oh I’m so sorry! Of course this hurts like hell. You guy are living in a gray zone where there is very little understanding about what is happening and no clarity about the exact direction you are heading in with each other.
First and foremost, you need to deal with the hurt by facing it inside of yourself.
The babysitter doesn’t matter at this point. You are giving her quite a bit of power by asking him about her several times. Complete honesty from him is not the kind of relationship you have with each other right now. You are not a couple. You guys are technically friends…but obviously the emotions run much deeper than that. I think it would be a good idea to set some boundaries. He is right when he put boundaries up and not wanting to talk about the babysitter or whether he is dating or not. That is not a topic that is up for discussion UNLESS there is a clear agreement about you guys staying committed to each other while working through this stuff. Right now, that is a choice you are making and sounds like he is making, but that’s all it is….is a choice…it is not a commitment.
I know it hurts. I don’t know what is going on for him right now, but what needs to be dealt with is your hurt and confusion. You are investing ALL of your energy into this relationship and I think what just happened is that you got a big reality check. You got caught up in the fantasy of how things could be and lost track of how things really are. Your dream just got shattered and that’s why it hurts so much.
Once you deal with the hurt of all of this, THEN you can decide what is best for you. Your therapist can definitely do some EMDR to help you through this and create some clarity.
Thoughts?
Heidi
Hi Ana,
I’m so sorry for what you are going through. I know how hard it is to feel rejected and not valuable. It’s awful! We are glad you are here and sharing your challenges with us.
First, I want to reflect back to you what you are saying:
You were with someone who you felt like was “the one” and then became distant, uninterested and is ignoring you. I’m curious, what makes you feel like he is “the one” for you, considering how you feel around him?
The only thing you are responsible for in all of this, is you are abandoning YOURSELF. You felt ignored and not connected and you chose to go on Tinder instead of using your voice and working through it with him. You are still choosing to stay connected to a guy who is not forgiving and behaving like a child by ignoring you instead of talking with you like an adult. All you are focused on is what you did wrong and that you want to get him back. Are you sure you want a guy like that back in your life? Are you sure you want to keep fighting for a relationship where you felt ignored and distant from him??
Heidi
