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Hi Cynthia,
Everyone is so worried about traveling these days. I’m glad you are choosing to go anyways! I know a handful of people who have canceled their trips.
I want to encourage you to not let him take you to the airport. This vacation is important for you and it’s even more important that you start it off with a good mindset. If he takes you to the airport, it starts your trip off having to deal with heartache. If you want to see him before you go, plan it the day before or something, but let the day that you leave, just be yours. Get your mindset in a good spot to leave and create the intention to start your vacation off with complete peace, clarity, fun and adventure. No heartache allowed…you can collect your heartache when you get back. Just a thought…
Heidi
Hi Cynthia,
Of course you feel held back!!! There is no closure here and it hurts like crazy! This is why setting your boundaries and getting clear about what you want and need is so important. Even though he hasn’t decided yet, it can give you some sense of control in your life.
Your love for him is so beutiful and it hurts to not get to feed that, feel that in yourself and nourish it. You lost a part of yourself, when he walked away. You are also discovering new parts of yourself too. Either way, it’s all confusing, hurtful and wonderful at the same time. Growing and changing is most of time pretty uncomfortable. You are right though. You will need to create some kind of closure, if he is not willing to. But for now, you said what you needed to, you will go on your vacation and you will deal with the next steps when you come back. So for now, no decisions need to be made, except the ones that nourish and fill you up. You get to hurt, cry, laugh, meet new people, see new things and just be whatever it is that you need to be for the next few weeks. ALL OF IT is good stuff for you…whatever shows up. Just stay connected to yourself. Maybe take a journal?Heidi
Hi Sarah,
Thank you for sharing more. I understand how difficult it is to watch someone make choices in their lives that are harmful, which in turn affects you. His choices to stay in this pattern, choose pot to help him survive his life and not make choices to grow and learn about himself…has to be incredibly difficult for you to watch, knowing there is another way.
I know you love him. It feels wonderful to love someone AND love is not enough to keep a relationship together. Science has revealed many times over that the breaking point of relationships is how the couple handles stress together. You both approach stress in VERY different ways, which creates a HUGE barrier and will always limit how close you guys will be. You are only as strong as your weakest link, right? Well…if he wants to choose to be in a relationship with misery, limiting beliefs and pot…then that means you are in a relationship with those things too…despite how wonderful and amazing your activities are together. Your relationship will only be as strong as the limiting beliefs you both carry. Since he is not the type to grow, learn and heal, then you will ALWAYS be limited in your own growth and the growth of your relationship.
So let me ask you this, imagine he stays exactly the same. He still is in a job he doesn’t love nor believes that’s something he needs, he is not interested in facing his issues, he isn’t interested in any of your expertise on how to help him, he has mood swings etc. Now imagine being with him like this for 10 more years. How does that make you feel?
When I coach people on considering their life partner, I always coach them from the mindset of choosing a partner by their worst qualities first and foremost and THEN their best qualities. The worst qualities in a couple is what will make or break the relationship. So if you were to choose him from his worst qualities, knowing this is just who he is and is not going to change, would you invite him into your life on deep levels?
Heidi
Hi MC,
You are asking some great questions!
When he is feeling negative and challenged at work, it’s activating you feeling very powerless to fix it for him. Feeling powerless is really difficult, however it’s such a wonderful thing to embrace, instead of run away from. It is VERY unrealistic to expect that every time you are together is supposed to be amazing. It’s VERY important for you to feel comfortable supporting him when he is having a hard time, otherwise your relationship will not be able to last a long time. You need to be able to feel okay, even when he is struggling. Here is an analogy. A healthy way to support each other is when one person is having a hard time, they are like a tornado. Their partner can be the ground. The ground is there to support and stay connected to the tornado, NOT to become the tornado. The ground is separate than the tornado. The ground stays solid and quiet and then when the tornado is done, everything is calm again. So it’s not your job to fix anything for him, it’s your job to just be the ground. Your job is to be that person he can stay connected to, when he feels his life is spinning and getting chaotic. That’s all he needs. So instead of wanting to help him fix his pain, trust that the challenge he is facing right now, is helping him to become a stronger man. When he is negative, all you need to do is remind him of his best self. FOr example, if he says, “I don’t think I can take this anymore” you would say something like, “I KNOW you can. I know what you are going through right now is very hard. What I also know is you are smart. You are resilient. You are strong and I have 100% confidence in you, that you will figure this out.” When you say things like that, you are reminding him of his qualities and abilities to handle stress. That is one way to deal with his negativity. Another way is to dive into it with him. So if he says, “I don’t think I can take this anymore” you would say “I get it. You feel like the entire world is sitting on your shoulders. What does that feel like for you?” So by asking him question after question about different ways he is feeling, you are allowing the space for him to feel what he needs, talk about it and even put his brain into the processing mode. So many times, I have had people walk away feeling completely better, just because they emptied out, got to say everything they needed to, they felt I was interested and a good listener because of all the questions I asked…and that’s all they needed.
How do you feel about approaching it this way? Most importantly, how do you feel about changing your perspective about your role in his life when he is stressed out?
Heidi
Hi FT,
You are going through a lot. I’m so sorry. It is incredibly difficult to watch someone pulling away and there is nothing you can do about it. It’s a very powerless feeling.
I agree in that it’s wise to take a step back. Again, it sounds like he is really enjoying just living his life and not having to think about you and your needs. I understand that there was a lot of connection between you guys. I also hear how much that connection took an incredible amount of work. The way things were going, I don’t really see how it’s the kind of relationship that was sustainable. He sounds like a very high maintenance kind of guy and quite fragile in many areas of his life. And that’s okay! He gets to be that! Despite your understanding of his limitations though, I think that it was too much for you. It doesn’t sound like it was a peaceful relationship for you either, as you had A LOT of needs that were not being met in different areas. Like Kanya said, this is who he is. I know you are willing to step back and not initiate, but would you maybe consider that maybe it’s best to let go of him entirely? Would you be willing to consider that a relationship with him is always going to take a lot of work and that maybe all that work is just more stress than you are willing to invite into your life?
Heidi
Hi Vino,
what amazing writing! I really enjoy how honest you are and the thoughts and feelings you share. It’s a lot and it’s all very powerful!
It sounds like you are ready to dive a little deeper in everything you are feeling and allow yourself some time to recover. I’ve taken many hibernation periods and they can be quite wonderful if used for all it offers!
Losing the store is interesting isn’t it? When there is loss, there are things you end up feeling that you didn’t know you felt when you had it. That place was something solid in your life. It was part of your identity and now it’s gone. All kinds of stuff is surfacing now from it. What are you doing to deal with everything you are feeling? You want to work on not letting your system go numb if you can. One thing I say to myself MANY times is “It’s safe to feel Heidi. It’s okay to feel whatever you need to feel Heidi. It’s okay to feel and be safe Heidi.” Keep giving yourself permission to feel whatever is needed. Just saying it in your mind is helpful. It can help counteract your system’s need to go numb.
You said “It bothers me when he asks me out.” I am wondering why it “bothers” you. What button is he pushing? He is just being a guy who is interested in meeting you and doing what any guy does…he asks a girl out. So what that you are not attracted to him. Does that mean he should stop trying to connect?
“What happens when i stop laughing? And sink into my pain? Who wants to be around me then? idk. I think dating allows you to figure out if you want a person in your life or not. Or in what way. You might work better as friends than as lovers.” Every single human being has a difficult side. Every person is unkind, loses patience, has trouble forgiving, judges…we ALL are like this and yet, people are still able to love each other. I know that a man can love the worst in me because I accept that part of myself. I deserve to be loved for ALL that I am, not just my best parts. You know what that’s like…you offer that to your kids. Why not believe it’s possible to receive that in return? JB, no matter who this person is, is even giving you that experience. You blew up on him and yet he still returned and connected with you again.
Dating is not about figuring out if you want someone in your life or not. If you really get to the core of dating, it’s all about discovering yourself. When I dated, it was with soooo many different types of guys because I wanted to know more about myself. When we are sitting in front of someone, we end up feeling a mix of ourselves, that only that 1 person can bring out. And then from there, we decide if we want to keep feeling that particular mix of ourselves around that person or not. All the other stuff about dating is based off of that one foundational feeling. People call it a million different things like chemistry, attraction, connection etc. but it’s actually never about the other person….it’s always about how WE feel in front of that person. So…maybe at some point, consider just “dating” since you have never done it before. You don’t even have to be attracted to him. Just go anyway and discover all different mixes of yourself. It might even be good to go on dates with guys you aren’t attracted to because there is no pressure. You won’t feel the need to try to make something happen, so it would be more comfortable. I remember that I committed for season to go our with ANY guy who had the courage to ask me. It wouldn’t matter if he was ugly, fat or gorgeous and snobby. I went (as long as I felt safe of course). I did this because I wanted to see what I would be like…and boy did I learn a lot!!!! So for you, dating would just be an experiment and an adventure where you get to know yourself…all the ins and outs that make you tick and not tick. Just a thought for when you recover from what you are dealing with now.
Did your daughter get back from TX yet? Is she safe? Did she have fun?
Heidi
Hi Vino,
I totally get your inability to cry. I used to be like that as well. The more intense that something was happening, the more my system would just shut down and I would go numb. It used to take quite a bit of time and for more challenges to show up, to actually push me over the edge and feel the tears that I knew had to be there. Lots of walls, right?
This makes a lot of sense about you never having dated. This is great then! We can walk you through how to go about that! Puppy love is sweet, but as you said, it’s time to grow up that part of yourself. It’s time to date and start to learn who you are in that part of life. It will help you be better equipped to be in a longer-term relationship anyways.
So let’s talk about your response to JB. What made you so angry? What caused you to be verbally abusive?? I don’t want to focus on what he said and did that was the trigger, I’m interested in hearing about your trigger. What button in you, did he push? How did he make you feel with whatever it is that he said?
Again, let’s stay grounded here. Nobody knows who he really is and it doesn’t sound like he is interested in meeting any time soon. I imagine he just stays connected to you because you are a comfort for him and there is a level of a friendship there, with the safety of hiding behind a computer. It’s not real. It doesn’t matter anymore what he says or doesn’t say and whether it’s true. His choice is to remain hiding and he gets to do that. Your choice is now to see if you are interested in staying connected to someone who is only interested in connecting over the computer and wishes to stay anonymous in a big way. It doesn’t matter that you can get into arguments and still come back together. JB could be a women, transgender, a 75 year old man, a con artist…JB could be ANYONE! You do not have a single ounce of proof of whether or not anything he is saying to you is actually true. Just keep yourself grounded in the truth of this relationship.
Dating is tricky. You can get to know someone pretty quickly, but also not. The surface, the characteristics and the general feeling about a person can easily be determined, but the deeper layers, the subconscious, is where it takes time to see a person in action. So let’s talk about you dating. Do you have resistence to it? When you think about dating, what do you imagine that is like? What does dating mean to you? Do you know why you avoid it?
Heidi
Hi Laila,
I responded to the other post you wrote, so let’s just ignore this thread and communicate in the other one.
Thanks!
Hi Zuzana,
So what is the relationship like right now? Is he initiating any contact at all? If yes, how often? If no, it sounds like your plan is to contact him every Monday. I do not suggest calling. I know you want to rescue him from his pain and help him through this, especially so he could have room for you down the road. Calling is a little too much at this point. He doesn’t need to “listen” right now. He will figure this out the way he wants to. So your best bet is to send articles he could read, videos that have good advice or videos that would make him laugh. That’s about it. I better like the idea of once every other week, like Kanya just suggested. He is still in the thick of things and he seems to respond much better when he has some space from you. Go super slow for right now. Then…when things calm down and he finds himself again, he may start to feel like he wants more with you and he will initiate that on his own with you. First and foremost, he NEEDS to believe you truly are his friend and not going to push him into anything he isn’t ready for right now. So every other week feels like a better way to communicate that to him. It’s just enough contact to let him know you haven’t forgotten him and it’s just enough space for him to not feel pressured to connect.
For what he is going through Zuzana, I wouldn’t be surprised if it took him a good year to really resolve everything. Is this okay for you? I’m curious what kind of timeline you have in your mind? How long are you willing to wait for him?
Heidi
Hi Laila,
Welcome! We are glad you are here sharing all of this.
First, I am wondering how you feel about moving so fast into another relationship after the break from your 13 year relationship. This is a pretty fast move. You have barely had time to figure out who you are as a person, separate from the guy you were with for a very long time. You haven’t had time to really grieve the loss, to feel all the changes in your life because of the breakup and to experience life as a single person for awhile. What are your thoughts on this?
As far as his behavior, everything he is showing you is that he is not committed on any level, other than being friends with benefits. As long as you participate in that design, you are stacking the cards against you. You are telling him you want more from him, yet you are not setting those boundaries with him. You are letting him connect when he wants, have sex with you when he wants, spend a weekend together and have an amazing time, but then he bails when he wants. His hot and cold behavior is telling you everything you need to know about him. If you want that behavior to change, you need to decide what you want with him and set boundaries around that. If you want more and he is not willing to give that you, then just be friends. No more sex, no more daily connecting (that is not normal friend behavior for a man and woman), no more weekends together. If you want friends with benefits, then no talking about how you feel about him and that you think things could go somewhere. Just be friends and have sex sometimes and that’s it. Him sending mixed messages IS confusing, but the way to stop that is for YOU to be clear and then aling your action with your choices. Does this make sense?
Heidi
Hi Cynthia,
Like Kanya, I am not surprised about his efforts to want to keep you connected. I also agree in that I do not think he is serious about any of it. At this point, all he is using is his words.
The thing about your husband Cynthia, is he is so lost. Even if he were to break up with her and come back to you, nothing INSIDE OF HIM is changing. All that is changing is who he is connecting in with. Whoever he connects to, is who he is defined by. Basically, he is a guy who has a SUPER HIGH need to feel valuable…to the point that he is co-dependent. If you think about it, he was more healthy and active when he was with you. Once he disconnects from you and how you like to live your life, he plugs into her way of living…fast food, not active, doesn’t really go anywhere. This, in and of itself, tells you how much he relies on the woman he is plugged into, to define him. He has no idea who he is, separate from you and separate from her. So he NEEDS to jump right back into you if he is going to live a better life and stop feeling used. He has chosen to allow himself to be used in the way he is. He has chosen to let go of fighting for his own health. OF COURSE he knows the consequences of all the horrible food he is eating. He is a grown man.
So Cynthia, this brings me back to my original question. What EXACLTY do you want from him. So let’s say he breaks up with her and proves to you that he is no longer seeing her or connecting with her after a few months. What then? The original issues that caused him to leave in the first place are still there. The original feelings he has about himself and how empty he feels are still going to be there. Are you expecting everything to just be okay? Him coming back to you needs to be more than about him proving anything to you. Your relationship has been broken and there were issues happening in him, even before he made this choice. Those issues are still there. So HOW do you want to fix your marriage with him? What’s your ACTION plan? For example, you can set some specific boundaries like he can’t move back in for 6 months. You guys can start to go on dates again. You will go through 3 different books and make a plan about how to improve your relationship. You want to have several conversations about why he has made the choices he did and what he is going to do IN THE FUTURE to prevent it from happening again.
Do you see what I am getting at? You have been so focused on just wanting him back, that all you really are requiring of him is that he convinces you he is done with her, when that is just the beginning and not the problem that truly needs to be solved.
As far as driving you to the airport, that is your choice Cynthia. How you behave on vacation is about your own integrity and the kind of person you want to be. Again, you are trying to base your actions and behaviors according to his. That is putting the power in HIS hands. YOU DECIDE what you want and then go from there. There is no need to communicate any of this to him. You have communicated what you needed. He is not responding enough to give you what you want. Truth is, you may be leaving the door open for someone else, but you are in no position to be entering into any thoughtful or serious relationship. You are not done with your husband and are not clear. So anyone you meet at this point, would be just for fun and a rebound kind of thing. If you feel okay about that, then you get to experience what that kind of thing feels like. It’s part of you learning about yourself.
Thoughts?
Heidi
Hi Michelle,
It sounds like you are very clear then. You will get back together with him, even if nothing changes, but he has to be the one to initiate it….am I reading this clearly?
As far as Hawaii goes, I want to encourage you to really consider your choice. “Yes will it be painful – it will open up more wounds when we get back sure. But that is the chance I have to take.” This kind of statement is actually not a very loving thing towards yourself. You love him soooo much that you are willing to overlook his choices and how he has treated you. Do you feel that is a caring and loving thing to allow into your life? To purposefully choose to walk into a situation where you will open up a lot of wounds, deal with a ton of rejection and who knows what else, on vacation with an ex boyfriend who is so confused and inconsistent…I would say you are wanting to love him more than yourself…and that is the danger. You will start to lose more and more of yourself as you choose to keep stepping into connection with a man who is so wounded and not emotionally available. Your love for him, no matter how great, is not enough. He doesn’t love himself and is so very fragile, which means he will never be able to love another deeply and in a healthy way. His woundedness will always get in the way of any relationship he is in. It does for all of us. The relationships that do work are when BOTH people own their own issues, they work on them, they grow together, they learn and are 100% committed to facing their fears. No matter how wonderful he is, he is not those things right now.
Just some things to think about.
Regardless Michelle, no matter what you choose, you will be okay and figure this out. With every choice you make and interaction you have with him, each time you are gathering more and more information which can help you become more clear about what you are willing to fight for. So we are here for you and will help you through any decision you make!
Heidi
Hi Julia,
I know it’s sad. I know it will hurt at first. I know it will be really difficult. It’s not an instant, quick fix, but it may end up getting you exactly what you want in the long run. You have been cheated on so many times already and now you are with a guy who is cheating right in front of you. He already has established that pattern with you that it’s okay to be with 2 women at the same time. So that’s a pattern that needs to be broken and the only way to do that is to not participate anymore and then teach him how to respect you and your boundaries. Remember, YOU are the teacher about how people treat you. So give this time. It may eventually end up that your friendship continues to grow and that at some point, he really realizes he wants to be with you. BUT…he has to respect you first.
I am proud of you. I know how hard this is. You most likely may fall back into the old pattern a few more times and that’s okay. You get back up and keep working on teaching him how you want to be treated, WITHOUT sex. Let’s see how this goes! Keep us updated!!!
Heidi
Dam cheeeese! I LOVE cheese, but it definitely is a weight gain kind of food! You were at pole class, so does that mean your leg/hip feels better? How did you help it heal??
Ya…maybe no package yet since it would be sent to his parent’s house. I know many people are not into the essential oil thing (especially guys) and I get made fun of all the time. At my gym, being surrounded by male trainers, they always have shit to give me when I pull out my oils for when my clients aren’t feeling well or feeling low energy. BUT….every single one of those guys asks for my help when they don’t feel well and of course, that is my moment to give them shit back. lol! At the very least, it smells good 🙂
When I first started Marco Polo, I was sooooo uncomfortable being on video. Same with my friends when I invited them. But after about a week or 2, you just get used to it and stop thinking about it so much. It just becomes so much fun to connect and send and receive messages and it just ends up being okay. All my friends around the globe have seen me with seriously bad bed head, acting super goofy as well as moments of crying. It’s a good practice to just learn to be okay being your most authentic self and find out you are still loveable. 🙂
heidi
(is that a threat or a promise?! lol 🙂 ) hahaha! Even in your struggle and depression, you are funny.
First, I think it is quite a beautiful thing that you stayed up late, philosophizing with your daughter, even though it caused you to miss the morning hour. I would say that is a motherly thing to do. You chose to connect with her and go with the moment. That’s a very loving thing to do. You created a memory with her. You added to your bond with her. So you could look at your choice in 2 different ways. 1. you were not respecting yourself and getting your needs met by staying up late and connecting with your daughter OR 2. you were respecting yourself by adding to you and daughter’s life by investing valuable time and conversation into a very important relationship in your life. To me, what you did, was a very respectful thing. Part of your job, as a mother, is to do the very best you can to create a good human being that is going to add to the world as they come to join the rest of us in adulthood. Wouldn’t you say that your choice helped do that? Isn’t that a respectful thing?
Yes, I get your thought process though. It sounds like you have a pattern of not being able to follow through on your own needs. First, it is a VERY COMMON and NORMAL thing for parents to feel. Their kids are typically their priority and that is how it should be. As the kids get older, it’s okay to start to say more no’s to them and more yes’s to yourself. But, it can be hard as the parent has spent years meeting the needs of their kids over their own. It can take some time to shift that way of thinking and living. So first, just be kind to yourself as you figure this out. Second, we ALL are always working on that balance of meeting our own needs vs. others. It’s something that is always going to be shifting and changing. My guess is, you have some deeper, core issues that cause you to choose others over yourself. It’s was most likely a coping mechanism that helped you survive growing up, but like all coping mechanisms, as much as they serve us and help us in the beginning, they can end up causing us a lot of challenge and hurt when we are adults. Oh well! It just gives us all something to work on. If it weren’t this issue, it would be something else, right?
I’m not surprised you are depressed. I would be too. It’s an ending of the work family and work home and right now, you don’t have anywhere to transfer that energy and connection to. So for now, you are going to be in limbo and that is never a comfortable place. I hope you are able to get out walking soon, as that sounds like something that really helps you.
Heidi
