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Hi Laila,
I responded to the other post you wrote, so let’s just ignore this thread and communicate in the other one.
Thanks!
Hi Zuzana,
So what is the relationship like right now? Is he initiating any contact at all? If yes, how often? If no, it sounds like your plan is to contact him every Monday. I do not suggest calling. I know you want to rescue him from his pain and help him through this, especially so he could have room for you down the road. Calling is a little too much at this point. He doesn’t need to “listen” right now. He will figure this out the way he wants to. So your best bet is to send articles he could read, videos that have good advice or videos that would make him laugh. That’s about it. I better like the idea of once every other week, like Kanya just suggested. He is still in the thick of things and he seems to respond much better when he has some space from you. Go super slow for right now. Then…when things calm down and he finds himself again, he may start to feel like he wants more with you and he will initiate that on his own with you. First and foremost, he NEEDS to believe you truly are his friend and not going to push him into anything he isn’t ready for right now. So every other week feels like a better way to communicate that to him. It’s just enough contact to let him know you haven’t forgotten him and it’s just enough space for him to not feel pressured to connect.
For what he is going through Zuzana, I wouldn’t be surprised if it took him a good year to really resolve everything. Is this okay for you? I’m curious what kind of timeline you have in your mind? How long are you willing to wait for him?
Heidi
Hi Laila,
Welcome! We are glad you are here sharing all of this.
First, I am wondering how you feel about moving so fast into another relationship after the break from your 13 year relationship. This is a pretty fast move. You have barely had time to figure out who you are as a person, separate from the guy you were with for a very long time. You haven’t had time to really grieve the loss, to feel all the changes in your life because of the breakup and to experience life as a single person for awhile. What are your thoughts on this?
As far as his behavior, everything he is showing you is that he is not committed on any level, other than being friends with benefits. As long as you participate in that design, you are stacking the cards against you. You are telling him you want more from him, yet you are not setting those boundaries with him. You are letting him connect when he wants, have sex with you when he wants, spend a weekend together and have an amazing time, but then he bails when he wants. His hot and cold behavior is telling you everything you need to know about him. If you want that behavior to change, you need to decide what you want with him and set boundaries around that. If you want more and he is not willing to give that you, then just be friends. No more sex, no more daily connecting (that is not normal friend behavior for a man and woman), no more weekends together. If you want friends with benefits, then no talking about how you feel about him and that you think things could go somewhere. Just be friends and have sex sometimes and that’s it. Him sending mixed messages IS confusing, but the way to stop that is for YOU to be clear and then aling your action with your choices. Does this make sense?
Heidi
Hi Cynthia,
Like Kanya, I am not surprised about his efforts to want to keep you connected. I also agree in that I do not think he is serious about any of it. At this point, all he is using is his words.
The thing about your husband Cynthia, is he is so lost. Even if he were to break up with her and come back to you, nothing INSIDE OF HIM is changing. All that is changing is who he is connecting in with. Whoever he connects to, is who he is defined by. Basically, he is a guy who has a SUPER HIGH need to feel valuable…to the point that he is co-dependent. If you think about it, he was more healthy and active when he was with you. Once he disconnects from you and how you like to live your life, he plugs into her way of living…fast food, not active, doesn’t really go anywhere. This, in and of itself, tells you how much he relies on the woman he is plugged into, to define him. He has no idea who he is, separate from you and separate from her. So he NEEDS to jump right back into you if he is going to live a better life and stop feeling used. He has chosen to allow himself to be used in the way he is. He has chosen to let go of fighting for his own health. OF COURSE he knows the consequences of all the horrible food he is eating. He is a grown man.
So Cynthia, this brings me back to my original question. What EXACLTY do you want from him. So let’s say he breaks up with her and proves to you that he is no longer seeing her or connecting with her after a few months. What then? The original issues that caused him to leave in the first place are still there. The original feelings he has about himself and how empty he feels are still going to be there. Are you expecting everything to just be okay? Him coming back to you needs to be more than about him proving anything to you. Your relationship has been broken and there were issues happening in him, even before he made this choice. Those issues are still there. So HOW do you want to fix your marriage with him? What’s your ACTION plan? For example, you can set some specific boundaries like he can’t move back in for 6 months. You guys can start to go on dates again. You will go through 3 different books and make a plan about how to improve your relationship. You want to have several conversations about why he has made the choices he did and what he is going to do IN THE FUTURE to prevent it from happening again.
Do you see what I am getting at? You have been so focused on just wanting him back, that all you really are requiring of him is that he convinces you he is done with her, when that is just the beginning and not the problem that truly needs to be solved.
As far as driving you to the airport, that is your choice Cynthia. How you behave on vacation is about your own integrity and the kind of person you want to be. Again, you are trying to base your actions and behaviors according to his. That is putting the power in HIS hands. YOU DECIDE what you want and then go from there. There is no need to communicate any of this to him. You have communicated what you needed. He is not responding enough to give you what you want. Truth is, you may be leaving the door open for someone else, but you are in no position to be entering into any thoughtful or serious relationship. You are not done with your husband and are not clear. So anyone you meet at this point, would be just for fun and a rebound kind of thing. If you feel okay about that, then you get to experience what that kind of thing feels like. It’s part of you learning about yourself.
Thoughts?
Heidi
Hi Michelle,
It sounds like you are very clear then. You will get back together with him, even if nothing changes, but he has to be the one to initiate it….am I reading this clearly?
As far as Hawaii goes, I want to encourage you to really consider your choice. “Yes will it be painful – it will open up more wounds when we get back sure. But that is the chance I have to take.” This kind of statement is actually not a very loving thing towards yourself. You love him soooo much that you are willing to overlook his choices and how he has treated you. Do you feel that is a caring and loving thing to allow into your life? To purposefully choose to walk into a situation where you will open up a lot of wounds, deal with a ton of rejection and who knows what else, on vacation with an ex boyfriend who is so confused and inconsistent…I would say you are wanting to love him more than yourself…and that is the danger. You will start to lose more and more of yourself as you choose to keep stepping into connection with a man who is so wounded and not emotionally available. Your love for him, no matter how great, is not enough. He doesn’t love himself and is so very fragile, which means he will never be able to love another deeply and in a healthy way. His woundedness will always get in the way of any relationship he is in. It does for all of us. The relationships that do work are when BOTH people own their own issues, they work on them, they grow together, they learn and are 100% committed to facing their fears. No matter how wonderful he is, he is not those things right now.
Just some things to think about.
Regardless Michelle, no matter what you choose, you will be okay and figure this out. With every choice you make and interaction you have with him, each time you are gathering more and more information which can help you become more clear about what you are willing to fight for. So we are here for you and will help you through any decision you make!
Heidi
Hi Julia,
I know it’s sad. I know it will hurt at first. I know it will be really difficult. It’s not an instant, quick fix, but it may end up getting you exactly what you want in the long run. You have been cheated on so many times already and now you are with a guy who is cheating right in front of you. He already has established that pattern with you that it’s okay to be with 2 women at the same time. So that’s a pattern that needs to be broken and the only way to do that is to not participate anymore and then teach him how to respect you and your boundaries. Remember, YOU are the teacher about how people treat you. So give this time. It may eventually end up that your friendship continues to grow and that at some point, he really realizes he wants to be with you. BUT…he has to respect you first.
I am proud of you. I know how hard this is. You most likely may fall back into the old pattern a few more times and that’s okay. You get back up and keep working on teaching him how you want to be treated, WITHOUT sex. Let’s see how this goes! Keep us updated!!!
Heidi
Dam cheeeese! I LOVE cheese, but it definitely is a weight gain kind of food! You were at pole class, so does that mean your leg/hip feels better? How did you help it heal??
Ya…maybe no package yet since it would be sent to his parent’s house. I know many people are not into the essential oil thing (especially guys) and I get made fun of all the time. At my gym, being surrounded by male trainers, they always have shit to give me when I pull out my oils for when my clients aren’t feeling well or feeling low energy. BUT….every single one of those guys asks for my help when they don’t feel well and of course, that is my moment to give them shit back. lol! At the very least, it smells good 🙂
When I first started Marco Polo, I was sooooo uncomfortable being on video. Same with my friends when I invited them. But after about a week or 2, you just get used to it and stop thinking about it so much. It just becomes so much fun to connect and send and receive messages and it just ends up being okay. All my friends around the globe have seen me with seriously bad bed head, acting super goofy as well as moments of crying. It’s a good practice to just learn to be okay being your most authentic self and find out you are still loveable. 🙂
heidi
(is that a threat or a promise?! lol 🙂 ) hahaha! Even in your struggle and depression, you are funny.
First, I think it is quite a beautiful thing that you stayed up late, philosophizing with your daughter, even though it caused you to miss the morning hour. I would say that is a motherly thing to do. You chose to connect with her and go with the moment. That’s a very loving thing to do. You created a memory with her. You added to your bond with her. So you could look at your choice in 2 different ways. 1. you were not respecting yourself and getting your needs met by staying up late and connecting with your daughter OR 2. you were respecting yourself by adding to you and daughter’s life by investing valuable time and conversation into a very important relationship in your life. To me, what you did, was a very respectful thing. Part of your job, as a mother, is to do the very best you can to create a good human being that is going to add to the world as they come to join the rest of us in adulthood. Wouldn’t you say that your choice helped do that? Isn’t that a respectful thing?
Yes, I get your thought process though. It sounds like you have a pattern of not being able to follow through on your own needs. First, it is a VERY COMMON and NORMAL thing for parents to feel. Their kids are typically their priority and that is how it should be. As the kids get older, it’s okay to start to say more no’s to them and more yes’s to yourself. But, it can be hard as the parent has spent years meeting the needs of their kids over their own. It can take some time to shift that way of thinking and living. So first, just be kind to yourself as you figure this out. Second, we ALL are always working on that balance of meeting our own needs vs. others. It’s something that is always going to be shifting and changing. My guess is, you have some deeper, core issues that cause you to choose others over yourself. It’s was most likely a coping mechanism that helped you survive growing up, but like all coping mechanisms, as much as they serve us and help us in the beginning, they can end up causing us a lot of challenge and hurt when we are adults. Oh well! It just gives us all something to work on. If it weren’t this issue, it would be something else, right?
I’m not surprised you are depressed. I would be too. It’s an ending of the work family and work home and right now, you don’t have anywhere to transfer that energy and connection to. So for now, you are going to be in limbo and that is never a comfortable place. I hope you are able to get out walking soon, as that sounds like something that really helps you.
Heidi
Hi Kajsa,
We are glad you are here. Thank you for sharing your challenge with us.
First, let’s talk a little more about the dynamics of your relationship. You have been together for a while now. Is this pattern normal? Has he been like this since the beginning, or just more recently? You also said that he sometimes stays later at work to get some alone time. Do you think that he may feel smothered on some level?
Have you ever just come straight out and asked him to be honest with you about the pattern you are noticing?
Heidi
Hey there!
Welcome! Thank you for sharing your questions with us. It would be helpful if you could share a bit more information.
From what it sounds like, the relationship was quite stressful. For a man, when his woman is not “happy” it can make him feel heavy and like a failure…constantly. It sounds like now that all the arguing has stopped, he is more connected to his relief than his connection for you. But it sounds like it’s the opposite experience for you.
Have you guys ever broken up before? Who initiated it? When you guys argued, was it basically about the same thing, or was it all over the place?
For now, professing your love to him is very nice, but it doesn’t change that his experience of having a relationship with you is stressful for him. So your love for him is not the core issue here. If you want him back, you need to go after the core issue. Do know what that is? Do you understand how he is feeling and why? How did you feel about the relationship? Was it stressful for you as well?
Heidi
Hello!
If you are interested in private coaching, you would work with a coach over the phone. There is not an option for private coaching through the forum.
Maybe there is something that can be arranged though. I can talk to someone and see if there is something we can provide for you, so we can meet your needs.
What exactly would like?
Heidi
Hi Sally!
Welcome! We would love to help you. Are you wanting to sign up for some private coaching on this issue, or would you like to work through some ideas here on the forum? If you want private coaching, I can connect you to the right people, just let me know.
If you want to talk here, it would be helpful to get a little backstory of your situation. I’m understanding that when you communicate your needs, he feels you are controlling and he ghosts…or disappears. Can you share more details?
How long have you guys been together? Has he always been like this? Do you see his view point at all…do you feel like you might have a need to control? When he disappears, how long does it take to come back together? How do you guys end up eventually resolving the situation?
Thanks Sally.
Heidi
Hi Julia,
I am soooo sorry to hear about how you had to grow up. There is no doubt you carry a lot of wounds and trauma from your experiences. I will address your question in a bit. I first want to address what you said.
“my mother died when i was 13 and my dad left me with my grandparents, in a man i search for that hug i needed when i was growing up, and this i can not offer to myself, i want to think about myself that i am not stupid, or i am disrespect-full to my own person, i am just a woman who s inner child needs a lot of attention.”
First, your trauma and hurt can be healed without a man. In fact, when you end up relying on a man to give you what you need, that hug, that attention, that love you crave, you will always be left disappointed. The reason is because you are wanting the guy to provide for you, what you are not providing for yourself. You are expecting the guy to make you feel whole and complete and happy. The truth is, a guy will ALWAYS disappoint you. He will ALWAYS hurt you….simply because he is human. Then what? Who is going to take care of you when he is the one hurting you? I want you to know that I deeply understand your pain and hurt. I too grew up with an incredibly painful childhood. I too wanted a guy to give me what I never felt from my father. The thing is, I learned that relying on others for my own happiness meant I was going to live a rollercoaster of a life. I would be happy when he made me happy. I would be sad and hurt and doubt myself when he was making mistakes. I was giving ALL of my power to the guy. I was letting him determine whether or not I was valuable. It’s rough to live that way! That darkness that you are trying to avoid, will always be there, no matter how many guys you date or fall in love with. I ended up facing my darkness, with some help from my therapist and you know what? I’m okay! Now…I do not need a man. I love having a man in my life, but I do not need him to make me feel better. I can do that all on my own. And because I can do that all on my own, I have self respect. The men that come into my life treat me extremely well, because I will accept nothing less than that. My point is Julia, there is another way. You do not have to continue to suffer from your past. YOU CAN HEAL and free yourself from the pain and hurt of it all. Is this a path you would be willing to consider?
In regards to your situation…the issue here is not that he doesn’t see how you view him. He knows that very clearly actually. He knows you see him as a man that is worth fighting for. He knows that you see him as someone who is very valuable to you. That is VERY CLEAR considering he has a girlfriend and you, giving him everything he wants. Like I said before, he doesn’t respect you. That’s the problem. He may care about you, he may really enjoy connecting with you, he obviously enjoys having sex with you and even taking care of you when you need it. Those are wonderful qualities for sure! AND…he is not respecting you as he knows it hurts you when he goes off with his girlfriend, but that doesn’t matter. He is going to do what he wants and he knows he can…because you always take him back and give him what he wants. This is not a situation where saying something specific will make him commit to you. This is a situation where he is a guy who gets to have whatever he wants with you and his girlfriend. So like I said before, this is about YOU setting boundaries for what you want and sticking to it. If you want a commitment from him, then don’t settle for less. If he doesn’t want to commit, then no sex. If you do this, I think you will find how he really feels about you and that is important for you to see. He most likely is not willing to give up his girlfriend for you. You say “i will not leave him just because he continues to make a mistake” but the thing is…he isn’t making any mistakes. He is making the same CHOICE over and over again. He is not viewing his choices as a mistake. He is not sorry. He is not making any changes. He just keeps repeating the same behavior over and over again, because he can.
So when he has a girlfriend AND you…I’m not sure what you expect from him. Are you wanting him to give up his girlfriend and then commit to you? Then what? You think he will stay loyal? You think he will not find a way to keep his “ex” a secret from you? You think he will just be able to fall madly in love with you and not need time to even recover from the loss of his ex?
Help me understand EXACTLY what you want to happen.
Heidi
ooooh noooo!!!! hahaha! That really sucks Emilie. Dam chocolate! lol. At least it’s fixable and they don’t have to pull it out.
You should mail him a little care package…like a study care package. Leave a simple note and fill the box with good study munchies…like pretzels, maybe some of your cookies, water or maybe even look up foods that increase brain power. Maybe you could even add an essential oil that he can just dab under his nose to help with focus. Anyway, since you won’t see him for a few weeks, it would be a sweet gesture. Just a thought.
Have you ever used Marco Polo? It’s an app that allows for video messaging. It’s different than recording a video and then sending it over text or we chat. I love this app, because it’s how I stay connected to my friends overseas. It’s sooooo easy. They record a video in the app, then I watch it and send one back when I can. There are all kinds of fun things you can with the videos too. Maybe try something like with him too…could be fun!
Or, of course, you could do none of these….lol
Heidi
Hi Vino!
You bring up some interesting points and I’m glad you are sharing these. I, of course, would like to offer you another perspective. I first want to validate you though. Self-respect and self-love are so important. However you treat yourself, is how you will require others to treat you that are close to you. I seriously love that you get excited about this stuff. Maybe consider instead of earning your own respect, you let yourself just have it. I’m wondering….why are you making yourself have to work for self-respect, yet you have never met JB and he has already earned your respect and trust. Why are you offering it so freely to him, yet you not to yourself? My other question is, what do you think you need to “do” to earn your own respect? I respect you tremendously, because you are someone that wants the truth and is willing to work with it. You are a fighter, you are a lover, you care deeply and want to be a better person. Yes, you have moments of being messy and limited, because you are human AND you stand back up, brush off your knees and keep moving forward. So….wouldn’t you say you deserve to respect yourself? What more do you want from yourself?
I’d like to talk about the trailer I sent you. Here was your response:
“OMG! That trailer – scarier than the most terrifying horror movies!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I could never do that! only hearing someone’s voice?”
Wouldn’t you say you are doing exactly this? You are offering JB your loyalty, part of your heart, your respect…you are building a pretty strong connection with him, without even hearing his voice. It’s no different than what these people on the show are doing. They are having conversations and building deeper connections with each other through those conversations. Wouldn’t you say that is what you have done with JB? No, you are not getting engaged or anything, but you are opening your heart and committing to someone you have never met. So maybe instead of judging those people on the show, you can instead see how similar you are to them….you just want to connect and have a deep experience and you are willing to risk quite a bit, without ever having met your person. Just something to think about.
Let’s talk about these statements you made:
“I would loss my own self-respect!!! This is a lose I wouldn’t be able to recover from.”
“because I would never recover from a half-assed loyalty, either in his eyes, or even my own”I’m curious why you believe this about yourself Vino. You have been through an incredible amount of challenge in your life. If anything, I would think you have enough trust in yourself to know that you always have figured out how to land back on your feet. You CAN recover from anything. It’s a choice. You are not a victim of life. You are a student of life. Self-respect or half-assed anything is nothing permanent and always changing. You will have moments you mess up big time. Does that mean you can’t recover from that? Are you telling me you would choose not to forgive yourself and figure out how to be better?
As far as JB goes, I’d like to encourage an approach where it’s not an all or nothing kind of thing. You going “all in” with your trust and commitment to him, is moving extremely fast and not honoring nor protecting your heart very well. Trust and respect need to be earned through time and experience with each other, none of which you have with him. When you say, “Being loyal to JB, whether he deserves it or not, is one of those things” you essentially are saying “I’m gonna just give him my loyalty and not care about how it affects me or what it costs me.” If your heart was a precious, rare diamond that is so valuable, it is kept under protection 24/7…would you, as the owner, just hand it over to someone you have never met? When you care about your heart THAT MUCH, you protect it. Using caution as you are getting to know someone is a wise thing. So I am encouraging you to pull back and use some caution. Of course, still move forward and work on trying to meet him, but work on keeping perspective. Your heart IS VALUABLE and deserves to be cared for and protected and respected by you. I know you believe you are respecting yourself by being loyal to JB. But are you really being respectful to yourself by offering your loyalty to a man you have never met, a man who does not have the same commitment towards you and a man who has been dodging meeting you for a very long time? I would venture to say that JB is talking to other women, maybe even going on dates. I would venture to say that yes, he does enjoy his connection with you, but is not committed to you on any level. So is it a respectful thing to yourself to offer someone something they are not offering to you in return?
So, let’s say there is a middle ground here in your approach to JB….a more balanced approach that is respectful to you as well as him. What do you think that could look like?
I’m looking forward to all your thoughts on this. I know you will have a lot of them!
Heidi
