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Hi Rose,
It’s soooo great to hear that you guys are re-connecting and things are slowly progressing. You both are learning how to be better for yourselves and with each other!
As far as him accusing you of “cheating” or seeing this other guy, don’t give it any energy. You DO NOT have to prove anything. The more you try to defend yourself, the more you try to convince him, it plays into his story and his fears. When YOU are centered and grounded in your truth, then he can join you there. When you start to play into HIS stories and fears, you then step off your center of truth. You KNOW the truth, so stay calm and grounded in that. It’s HIS insecurity and one HE has to deal with…it’s not for you to fix….it’s for him to fix. You have answered all his questions and that’s all you can do. If he wants to believe other people’s story over yours, then that is something you need to know about him. If it stops him from moving forward with you, then that is HIS fear getting in the way and sabotaging relationship and not for you to fix for him. His fear is evidence of his lack of forgiveness for being cheated on. He is still holding onto the pain from the past which is a HUGE barrier to begin with.
What’s important for you to do is to let him work this out on his own. I would simply say something like, “Look, I’ve told you the truth and answered all of your questions. If you don’t want to believe it, that’s your choice. There is nothing more I can do. I’m not going to continue to defend my innocence. I understand you have been cheated on many times by your ex. I am not her. I hope at some point you will be able to see that.” And leave it at that. Stop playing into his fear, stop defending yourself and don’t play in this game he is creating. It’s not your job to defend yourself by looking for the video and trying to convince him. By doing that, you are taking responsibility for HIS fears. Let him do the work he needs to do to face this.
Does this make sense?
Heidi
Hi EB,
Welcome!!! Thank you for sharing your thoughts with us. It’s wonderful to hear the articles are helping you!!! We look forward to hearing from you!
Heidi
Hi Bonnie,
Let’s address your feelings of embarrassment first about me saying you were in a fantasy. We ALL have fantasies. I have no judgment about it and I sure don’t blame you. When there is un-requited love happening, it’s impossible NOT fantasize about the person you wish you could be with. A fantasy is just an imagined story we give energy to, that’s all…and it’s okay! Fantasies are healthy and can be very helpful. Where fantasies can be dangerous and harmful though, is when it stops someone from living their life. The more the energy is focused on him, the less you have for yourself and building your life without him (as a romantic partner). Just something to consider, that’s all.
You also said that you get creeped out when men want to chat. What is that about? You have story around that, so let’s figure out how to change that story so you can enjoy chatting with men! It makes the whole process so much easier! I understand also have a need to punish yourself when you are hurting. When you are hurting, how about buying yourself a bouquet of beautiful flowers, making your favorite meal, watching your favorite movie, put on some warm fuzzy, soft pajamas….how about finding ways to comfort yourself instead of “punishing” yourself. When we are hurting, we need comfort to move through the hurt. So what can you do instead? Essentially all you are doing by “punishing” yourself is treating yourself the way your parents treated you. You are more than that and deserve love and respect and compassion and kindness when you are hurting. So what brings you comfort?
You have done a WONDERFUL job trying to reach out and meet new people. I know it hasn’t really worked out for you and it feels awful to feel rejected so much. I’m so sorry these have been your experiences. There is a simple principle….we don’t attract what we want, we attract who we are. For example, in my younger years, I was very successful with dating. I was comfortable, confident, there was no shortage of attention etc. In my later years, I went through a handful of years where I was rejected by ever single guy. I couldn’t get past a first date. I had to look inside and see how I was treating myself. All these men were rejecting me, so I asked “What am I doing to reject myself.” I really got to the root of what I was dealing with and discovered the MANY places I was not caring for myself. I was ignoring my feelings, I would get irritated with how I would feel, I was getting angry and shoving it deep down inside. I was eating really unhealthy and I was, deep down, not loving myself at all. That’s who I was at the time, therefore I attracted a bunch of experiences that reflected that. You feel you should punish yourself when you are hurting. That’s your parents’ role modeling of how to treat you that you have latched onto. So you end up attracting people and experiences that are rejecting of you. How does this land for you? What are your thoughts on this type of approach?
I would like to encourage you NOT to have that conversation with him. He hasn’t asked for your opinion about his life. True friends are accepting. You telling him everything he is doing wrong is quite judgmental and condescending. Regardless of what you say to him, he is who he is. He has been this way the entire time you have known him. He will change when and if he is ever ready to change. You pointing out all of his flaws is not going to serve him or your friendship. It’s not your job to hold him accountable. It’s your job to be his friend even WITH all of his limitations. There is another approach that may be more helpful. It’s talking with him about his decisions from a place of curiosity. It means asking a lot of questions to understand where he is coming from…to understand HIS thoughts about his life and decisions. So you would ask things like, “You have a strong pattern of jumping from one woman to the next. I wonder if your relationship with your mother contributes to that. What do you think?” Does this approach make sense?
Heidi
Just FYI…I will not be responding to any posts until Tuesday.
Looking forward to what you have to say!
Heidi
Hi Shannon,
Welcome to the forum! Thank you for sharing all of this with us.
I’m soooooo so sorry for what you are going through. It’s awful!!!! He definitely sent some mixed signals. It sounds like he might have changed his mind and he won’t admit it. He would rather ghost you than to be an adult about it and have a talk with you. It’s such an awful feeling to be left hanging like that.
It sounds like you have started to turn things around for yourself. Well done! When you like you, then it’s waaaaay easier for him to like you! Have you started working out again? Have you started wearing clothes that make you feel good? Are you being more positive?
Is it a possibility he might have met someone else? Is he online at all? I ask, because when someone ghosts like that, many times it’s because their attention went elsewhere – which is why ghosting is easier vs. just being honest.
For now, keep giving him space. You are doing a good job not reaching out anymore, so keep that up. If he reaches out to you, take some time before you respond. He needs to know you have a life and that he is not at the center of it. This usually triggers a hunting / chasing type of instinct. Do you feel you can do this?
Heidi
Hi Jodie,
When a guy really wants a girl, he will go for it. This guy is wishy washy. All his mixed signals are telling you, is that he is not sure. Why isn’t he sure? Who knows – but does it really matter? Don’t you want a guy who has NOTHING stopping him from wanting to be with you? Don’t you want a guy who is VERY CLEAR that he wants you in his life…daily?? You deserve to be valued and sought after. You deserve to feel like you matter every single day. This guy is NOT that person. Regardless of your strong feelings, he is not wishy washy and confused. You are just an option to him and someone for him to play out his issues. He’s playing a game and you are participating. When you respect yourself, you then demand respect from others or they can fall away. All you are teaching him is that he can treat you like this and you are going to participate…therefore you don’t have a lot of self-respect…which in turn means he doesn’t have to show that to you either.
Thoughts?
Heidi
Hi Rose,
Thank you for sharing more details. It’s helpful.
We all say things out of anger that are shocking. The first thing that is important, is that you are aware that you are capable of being mean and really hurting him when you are angry. Your awareness means that you can create a plan to support yourself so you don’t get to that point. You start with your coping mechanism of shutting down and going inside. I know this coping mechanism very well, as that is mine as well. I’ve had to do a TON of internal work and clearing the baggage in order to become an effective communicator, but the bottom line is, your voice, your feelings, your thoughts matter. When you shut down like that, you take away the chance for him to know who you are. When you voice things INSTANTLY, it gives him the opportunity to participate in your life. You also take away a chance for him to help you heal. How can he possibly improve if you don’t let him know in the moment. AND…it helps build trust, because you are being authentic. Whenever I am having a reaction to something, especially if its an over-reaction, I practice just saying “I KNOW I’m overreacting right now, but I just need to say this out loud. Can you help me by just listening for minute?”
I think it would also be a great thing for you to learn some skills about how to have conflict in a healthy way. Once I figured out how to say things that turned my feelings into a conversation vs. someone feeling attacked or judged, it helped me voice my feelings more. Here are a couple of blogs that may be helpful for you: https://www.gottman.com/?s=conflict+resolution
As far as building trust back up with him after saying that to him, there is 1 simple action step to take. You already apologized, but when he sees you take ACTION, his soul will rest easier. So if he knows and sees you reading a book, taking a program, communicating more, sharing what you are learning about communication with him, setting up ways you guys can communicate better etc. he will KNOW that you are working on becoming a better partner and that you are TRULY sorry for having said that. People in general, will believe a sorry when they see action is taken vs. just the words. Thoughts?
Heidi
Hi Bonnie,
I’m happy to work with you. You said “passing me over to someone else contributes to that trigger.” I want to just reiterate that you were not passed over. Kanya happened to log on before me today and she was just doing her job by responding to each post. Each person on the forum gets coached by both of us…it just depends on, between Kanya and I, who logs on first for the day. My purpose in clarifying this is to maybe help you with those feelings of being “passed on” as it is not true. One less thing to feel frustrated about. Hopefully, this helps!
So let’s talk about everything you are feeling. You have a TON of emotions coming up and it really is disturbing your life. What’s the core issue that you feel is being triggered? What does this experience with him remind you of? What is the source to all of these emotions you are having?
You’re having the emotions, but what are you saying to yourself during and after? What are you saying to yourself when the anxiety comes up?
Have you ever looked up TFT or EFT? You can just search those on youtube and there are a TON of videos about how to use the techniques. Either one works. It’s a form of tapping on certain meridian points on the body while saying certain things. I have used these techniques for over 2 decades! It helps move the energy and can help decrease the intensity. Sometimes it works instantly and sometimes it takes MANY MANY repetitions throughout each day, in order to have a bigger impact. Either way, it’s an effective tool to help manage emotions.
As far as them having a conversation about you, does it really matter why and how and what? Not really. What is true is that it’s time to let this guy go as a possible romantic partner. You can analyze all you want about this new girl and all of her insecurities and issues and you can analyze him and his limitations, but the truth you need to be connecting yourself with is that he is not available for you in the way you want. All the energy and thoughts and time you are spending on thinking about them, is a distraction from you truly grieving the loss of him and the fantasy you have carried around for years, that one day you’ll be together.
The truth is, he gets to hop into a relationship just after breaking up. He gets to pick women that are insecure. He gets to live his life however he wants. He gets to cheat if that is who he wants to be. You are literally torturing yourself by listening to him talk about all these other women, while you are in love with him and carry a fantasy about him. He is being very unkind to you by sharing all of it! He knows how you feel, yet he tells you anyway. The thing is, he sure isn’t going to protect you, so YOU NEED TO PROTECT YOURSELF!!! When your stomach goes into knots, LISTEN!!!! That’s your spirit telling you that it’s not healthy for you to be talking about these women with him. You keep exposing yourself to being hurt over and over and over and over again. At what point will you choose yourself over him? What will it take for you to say no to him and yes to yourself?
I know I’ve said some hard things. What you are dealing with is INCREDIBLY difficult. That’s why Kanya was suggesting a therapist. I know that if I were having to deal with what you are going through, I would be working with my coach on a weekly basis for sure. It’s a TON of stuff getting triggered inside of you and when that happens, it’s always a good thing to get extra help to process it all. Is that something that could be possible for you?
Heidi
Hi Bonnie!
The way that Kanya and I work as Coaches on this forum, is that whenever we log on, we respond to the posts that need responding to at that particular time. So your message wasn’t passed on, Kanya just happened to see your post before I logged on. She is EXCELLENT in her wisdom and is someone you can feel very safe with! Essentially, you are getting 2 experts to receive guidance from. If you would prefer to just have me respond, that is no problem at all. We can arrange for that. We are here to support you in whatever way feels good for you.
You are not being rude at all! You are a very good communicator and your questions and confusion are valid, so hopefully you feel more clear about this. I’m going to respond to your post a little later today as I want to spend more time with it.
Heidi
Hi Rose,
This is great news!!!
What did you say that hurt him? I imagine it was you wanting to purposefully hurt him somehow, yes? Is this a common pattern you have when you get angry? It’s quite common actually.
There are some things you can do, but let’s first talk about what you said. He said it really hurt and it sounds like he is being cautious with you, yes? Did you guys agree to the next steps? Where EXACTLY are you guys at right now as far as relationship status. Yes, you both are going to work on it, but what EXACTLY does that mean?
Heidi
It sounds like you want to stay though, for those 2 weeks paid leave at the end of January, yes? What could you do with those 2 weeks off? What kind of fun and pleasure can you fill yourself up with?
Those are all great examples. I would use those examples instead of using the terms “cherished” or “treasured.” Again, it will give the guy more of an understanding of who you are.
You could say something like, “I’m a bit old school and love when a door is opened for me. I value a man who is strong in who he is, yet respectful and open to hearing opposing thoughts and opinions.” This can maybe get you started on different ways to express what you are wanting to say, with a tad more detail. Write a bunch of sentences and post them here so we can offer our thoughts if you want.
I’m sorry those guys disappeared. It’s no fun! Hopefully it’s not causing you to doubt yourself. If it is, let’s talk about it!
Heidi
I am one of the guilty ones that Kanya talked about. I COVERED my very small patio with lights…lol. I soooo badly needed sparkly lights! hahaha! So I’m with ya with all the decorations!
You wrote some great stuff! It’s engaging, fun and descriptive in a way that is more interesting to read. I love that you are getting some responses.
With this particular sentence “Honesty, thoughtfulness and courtesy are traits I value. Cherish and treasure me and I will respect and appreciate you in return” you might want to think about being more specific. Thoughtfulness, courtesy, cherishing and treasuring can have different meanings for people. Some guys might take that as “high maintenance.” Also, to say “if you give me this, I’ll give you that” is setting up an exchange and that they have to go first. It’s a conditional type of connection that you are offering with that statement and can come across as demanding / manipulative / controlling (in a very subtle way). I KNOW you are meaning to be playful and that’s not how you feel.
So what does being courteous look like to you? How do you know someone is thoughtful? What would a guy do for you that would make you feel cherished and treasured?
Heidi
Hi Rose,
Of course you are nervous about talking. That’s pretty normal. Make sure you go into the conversation really connected to yourself. Meaning, it would be easy to becomes, say or do anything you can to get him back. That’s when you lose yourself. Stay connected to yourself and don’t give your power away to him just so you can have him back. He needs to know and love the REAL you. So if you disagree with him or if you are not comfortable with what he is saying, make sure you express that! What I also like to do BEFORE heading into conversations like these where I am nervous, is I remind myself over and over and over again that I am loveable, I am worth knowing and being with, even if they don’t think so. I will be okay even if “he” doesn’t choose me. I will be okay even if I need to say goodbye. I will be okay even if we end up just friends. This is the MOST IMPORTANT part for you. You need to stay connected to your value BEFORE you go into that conversation.
You want to view this conversation as if you are a reporter. Go in with curiosity and OPEN, listening ears. Ask questions that will give you enough information to write your “story” so to speak. When you enter a conversation with curiosity, it brings a different energy to the table and it can lighten things up a bit.
Lastly, DO NOT talk about your future together. DO NOT go into him being your “forever” person or that you feel you guys are meant to be together. Guys who are uncertain about a relationship, will feel a TON of pressure with those kinds of statements. Let him know that you are of the mindset and comfortable with just taking one day at a time.
Also make sure that when you meet with him, spend the day loving on yourself. Take a long shower, use a body scrub, put nice lotion on, wear an outfit that makes you feel beautiful, put nice music on that puts you in a good mood etc. You want to feel good when you go see him, so make sure you set yourself up for success that way.
Hopefully these tips are helpful. When are you guys going to talk?
Heidi
Hey there!
What EXACTLY are you wanting to learn about? I’m not sure if you are asking specifically about communication, about relationships, about men etc.
Here are a few great websites with some good info:
https://www.gottman.com/blog/
https://charlesjorlando.com/#advicecharlesjorlandocom-sectionHope some of this helps. But let us know more specifically what you are looking for.
Heidi
Hi Jodie,
Your confusion is valid and warranted. He is sending you mixed signals with his text messages. Guys do not say those kinds of things to their female friends.
I suggest you set a boundary and say something about it. You can say something like, “I’m confused and I need to clear something up. You want to just be friends, yet you say some things that someone would say when they like someone like “you are the apple of my eye” etc…..Those are not “friendship” type of things to say. It’s sending me mixed signals, so I wanted to talk about it. I’d like to hear your perspective.”
I suggest to have that conversation in person or over the phone, NOT over text.
Or…if you would just like to be more direct, you can just set a boundary. The next time he says something flirty or romantic, you can say “I appreciate what you say, but it’s sending me mixed messages. We are just friends. If you want something more, which is what it seems like when you say these kinds of romantic things, then talk to me about it. Otherwise, let’s agree to talk to each other just as friends and keep the romantic stuff out of it. Is that okay for you?”
Thoughts?
Heidi
