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Hi Coleen, Welcome tot he forum. I am so sorry. I would agree that is does not sound like he is in a relationship with you at this point. When he said that he needed to get his job back or get a new one, I think he was talking about these things happening BEFORE he could date again. It sucks that he can’t be more open and honest but it is important that you pay attention to what his actions are telling you.
I don’t think he has anything in him right now that he can put to a relationship, to building something with you or anyone for that matter. That is sad and frustrating. Covid has taken a lot from the lives of people and has side tracked, or ended a lot of new relationships. He doesn’t have anything to give you you right now and as a result he isn’t. What if you moved on but reached out to him to check in once a month or so? That way you could stay connected but not put your life on hold while his life in on hold. What kinds of feelings come up for you when you think of that idea?
Kanya
Hi LM, I appreciate your thoughtful response. It must be really difficult to imagine divorcing for all the reason you listed as well as man more. It can feel like a failure in so many ways. One thing I notice is your willingness to look at your part in all of this and do whatever it takes to make things better. That is really commendable!
And, you need to be honest about how much of the work you are doing versus hoe much of the work he is doing. There needs to be more balance if this is to work. Otherwise, your life becomes about pleasing someone who is literally incapable for being pleased. Given his personality, he will continue to make you feel incapable on many levels because his expectations for you are unrealistic. Can you share how this is affecting your self esteem? Yes, you can learn to work with his Narcissistic Personality but please get clear now about how much sacrifice you are willing to make. Are you willing to lose pieces of yourself in the process? The reason I am suggesting you figure this out now is because things can move slowly in one direction and you can wake up one day and realize a lot has been lost in the desire to stay with someone. I often recommend the book “Should I stay or Should I go? Surviving A Relationship with a Narcissist” to help people begin to sort through these ideas.
What are your deal breakers here ie: what do you absolutely need to have in your marriage to feel happy and valued? Do you have goals that he supports, shared plans and visions for your future? Is he participating in making these things come true?
Kanya
Hi Michele, I can understand why you would want to get things back on track. A 25 year marriage is really motivating. And, you are wise to see that this can only happen if he is 100% on board. I find it interesting that this new woman is pushing him to divorce. It might signal a sign of insecurity on her part. Perhaps things are not very rosy on that end. The infatuation stage can last for up to 3 years, This is sort of the honeymoon phase when things are going well and people are still easily motivated to accept each other and work to build the relationship. Do you think he has true love feelings for this other person? Given his age and his health history I wonder if he is striving to feel young again? Has he talked about wanting to experience falling in love, having that initial high of passion? Is this woman young than him? Have you noticed other changes in him such as buying a more fun car, getting in to shape, trying to look/feel younger? Has he experienced any physical transformations in the past few years? Can you share what red flags you noticed about him while he was having the affair? Did you have an idea that this was happening?
What have you done to find your voice and yourself in all of this? Did you allow yourself to feel the full range of emotions when this occurred? Did you get angry and express those feelings? Are you working with someone who can help you figure things out? As cliche as it counselings, the best thing you can do in this situation is to rebuild your life, love yourself, and really get clear about whether or not reconciling is the best thing for YOU. When this sort if thing happens, woman often feel rejected and experience a lot of self judgment. How are you doing in this area? It is important to work through any negative feelings you have about yourself now as this will help you clarify what you want. When you are then you can determine if your husband, just as he is, is the person you deserve to be with.
Yes, there are things you can do. Most importantly, create a life that makes you happy. I know that sounds weird but being happy, having a whole and interesting life is vital for your well being. And, it is interesting to men as well. Have you done any dating since you found out about the affair? It is a good idea to get out there and allow yourself to be seen by men. Smile. That will get a lot of positive feedback and will also trigger happy chemicals in your brain. Do you have children who are navigating this as well?
Kanya
Hi LM, I am so sorry that you are going through this.
It is interesting that you saw a change in him while he was on medication but he did not. This is often the case-family and friends are the first to notice a difference and the person taking the medication doesn’t notice it or is too self conscious to admit the change. One the over thinking starts to go away and people feel more comfortable, the change feels like too much, too out of control, too unfamiliar.
You have a personality that is more susceptible to your husband’s insecurities. This is because you learned to work hard for connection. You learned to go for long period of time without reassurance from the adults around you. You learned to hid your hurt and pain for fear of angering someone you loved. The things you did with your mom are similar to what you need to do with your husband to try to get connection with him. You mentioned that all of this makes it difficult to connect and just be present with him. That is because he can’t tolerate the closeness. He isn’t conscious of this and in actuality will say he wants that and then blame you when he can’t achieve it. Given what you describe I think there is a good chance that your husband is a narcissist. Here is an article outlining the behavior of someone who has a Narcissistic Personality. Does this sound familiar to you?
https://www.huffpost.com/entry/signs-you-married-a-narcissist_b_9132548
Kanya
Hi Eva, you are doing so great! I know that none of this is easy. It takes courage to try something new, to walk into the unknown. You are doing it and are starting to see how good that feels! It isn’t about fixing things. It really is able taking the time to let things unfold in our lives. Trusting ourselves is a great, often ignored gift that we all have been given. It sounds as though you are trusting yourself more and more.
For now he isn’t pushing which I’m sure is difficult for him. It is a new behavior and now that will take practice. What are you doing to support yourself at this time? Have you increased your self care? Who is on your support team these days helping you to remember to love yourself and take things slowly?
Kanya
Hi Emilie, Goshm I am sorry to hear about your sister. I don’t know about you but it seems like everyday I am hearing form someone I know that they, or a family member has tested positive. How long until you get your test results? Most importantly, how are you feeling? Please take good care of yourself and practice a lot of self care and self nurturing.
I think that his response left a possible opening in the future “nothing is done, my life is complicated AND canal lemon pie” one day;)” This can be interpreted in different ways. Sometimes, when we like someone, we may hold out hope that one day things will work out with that person. I was just saying that I don’ hear that happening with you which is a good thing.
Please keep us posted regarding your health and your results!
Kanya
Hi Maria, Welcome to the forum. We’re glad that you are here. I understand how frustrating this is for you. It is difficult, as a parent, to know when to introduce someone to your child. He hasn’t dated in the 7 years since he broke up with her mom so neither of them have been down that road before. You mentioned that he says he doesn’t know what is getting in the way for him. Has he said anything in the past that would give either off you a sense of any concerns or roadblocks? Does he talk about affecting his relationship with her? Has he said that he doesn’t want to upset her, or introduce her to multiple people? HAs he talked about not wanting to confuse her? Is his ex the type of person who would get upset and make life difficult for both of you?
If he literally doesn’t know why he won’t introduce you, and he hasn’t talked about any reason, then that is a concern for several reasons. First, he and/or the two of you, won’t be able to work this out and find a resolution. Second, it shows the degree to which he lacks self awareness and insight. It is really difficult to have a relationship when you don’t have insight. This sort of situation usually results in one person staying in their comfort zone while the other person learns to accommodate their needs – many of which are unspoken. Have you found yourself accommodating him in other ways to ensure his comfort level?
Kanya
Hi, I don’t think you are pathetic at all! It is really normal to miss the things we liked about someone. Even if you don’t know that person well or have ever seen them in person. You miss the fin and the attention that your communication brought. This is super understandable especially during this pandemic. All of our lives have been unbelievably different in these past 6 months. I’m glad you had something enjoyable during that time.
I get the sense he is not being honest with you on soooo many levels. Yes, he said he was open to video but I highly doubt that this would have actually happened. I think that he would have found a way to continue to avoid that. Why we don’t know why, I will say that it has something to do with him and nothing to do with you being worthy or important. He is clearly hiding something. He is leaving to door open if things don’t work out with this “new” person. I agree that he really doesn’t know what he wants. Do you feel any sense of relief now that you have your answer?
I think it is great that you see the connection between him and the personalities of the men in your life. We often to attract that which we are familiar with. And, you do have a choice about continuing to attract men like this. If you want a guy who has a calmer, more rational approach to lie and conflict you can certainly make that a personality trait that is important for you. The past doesn’t have to determine your future.
Kanya
Hi Rhonda, I wonder if the kayak rental on campus is closed at this time? Sorry you have to drive so far as it is so enjoyable for you!
I’m glad that you have some positive distractions these days and that the team you are working with is a good fit. The alternative of being stuck there and not liking your team would be very difficult. Do you find ways to spend social distance time with colleagues or friends these days? I know we are finding ways to extend outside time into the fall and winter this year. Have a great week!
Kanya
Hi, Thanks for the response and the additional information. I agree; no one is perfect. Whom ever we are dating will have personality traits that rub us the wrong way at times and may not always fit with out personality. If you look at the list above of things that seemed off or weird, are any of them deal breakers for you? If so, which ones just won’t work in your life? Also, if he is not open to face timing are you ready to stop communicating with him? Just trying to help you get clarity. I’m looking forward to healing from you!
Kanya
Emilie, I love the message that you sent. It was so authentic and so beautiful I’m glad that you trusted yourself enough to know that you needed to send it! Glad that the subject feels closed now and you aren’t trying to make something out of his kindness. I love the concept of the new you, though the old you is pretty spectacular as well! You are a rock star!
Kanya
Hi Rhonda, I can relate to what you are saying. It is hard, when you have such different ideas about faith and God that are in conflict with your family’s beliefs. I am sorry that they try to change you and judge you for those differences. I agree that this is not a very Christian way to behave. I remember you talking about your family in the thread in the past. You continue to do an amazing job caring for yourself, loving yourself, and taking care of yourself. That has meant distancing from your family which has been a loving act for yourself.
I am glad that you are open to getting to know Robin and building a friendship with him. He does sound very respectful and communicative which is so important. And, it sounds like you are both open to each having your own, differing, Spiritual believes. Being able to tolerate differences is super important expectably when it related to such a personal subject such as spirituality.
I’m sorry that the boarder continues to be closed and that you are not able to go home. I have never been in that situation and I can only imagine how challenging it is at times. I acknowledge you for really go with the flow in all of what is happening with the pandemic. The only power we have is in how we respond to what is happening. Sounds like you are doing a really great job of caring for yourself through all of this. I love that you can get out, hike, exercise, etc. If I remember correctly, you like to kayak. Is that something you can do in LA? It is a beautiful fall day in Pennsylvania today. Hope it is beautiful there and you can get out and enjoy the day!
Kanya
Hi Eva, This must be so confusing for you. He is now pursuing you and telling you the things that you have wanted to hear for a long time. I really acknowledge you for continuing to set clear boundaries with him. I’m sure it is not easy.
While what he is saying sound amazing, I think he has just flipped his switch again. He is reaching out to you but when you don’t respond quickly, he pushes you. He wants an answer right now and doesn’t want to sit with the feelings that he may have lost his opportunity with you. He has not learned to feel his feelings, to tolerate them, to be patient while you think about things. It’s the same pattern as before in that when he makes up his mind about something, either being with you or being apart from you, he wants it all to happen immediately. That is the same red flag as him deciding in an instant that things are over and then not talking to you anymore. While he thinks things have change, I agree with Heidi that he will need a lot more time to develop new n=habits that lead to behavioral change.
If you decide to talk to him please don’t just listen to his words, but also listen to his behavior. Since you have a strong tendency to want to take care of men who are in emotional distress, this is a conversation that requires you to stay focused and work with yourself. Even if he wants this now, you don’t have to do anything differently that will ‘make him feel better.’ If you do decide to listen be sure to take time away from the conversation to determine what is best for you. Please know that while he is understanding that past behavior was not healthy, it is far to soon for actually change to have occurred. Right now he is pursing u=you but if you start to see him again and the two of you get close, he will react and want to disappear. It will take a tremendous amount of inner work to change that pattern and for him to learn to stay while he is feeling uncomfortable. His current behavior tells me he is not even aware of how this pattern works. Be smart and realistic in your own thinking even if he is not able to be at this time.
It sounds like you may be talking tonight. We’re here for you!
Kanya
Hi J, Welcome to the forum! Like a lot of people, you are trying to get to know someone under unprecedented times and that is challenging on so manu levels! I agree that the stress of the world, as well as our current political climate is getting to a lot of us. People are experiencing more and more signs of depression, anxiety, and overwhelm. Did he ever talk about the stress he is feeling? When he gets upset does he apologize and then identify what is really bothering him? I know it is hard to do all of this via the phone I guess I am wondering what his emotional intelligence is like?
If he had been able to regulate his emotions ie; not assume you were being a dick to him but rather talk about things calmly, not jump to conclusions, etc then I would probably say go for it. There are just too many red flags here for me to feel positive about this guy. Having 4 fights in 3 months where you didn’t know each other does not make me confident that this is an easy going guy. He seems to have a strong personality trait of needing things go a very specific way. If they don’t go that way, he gets reactive.
He won’t see you even though there are many ways to do so safely during this pandemic. He won’t FaceTime you. Does he have social media account that you use to connect with him? Can you see that what is on his social media matches what he has told you about himself and his life? Have you see what he looks like? He seems highly secretive and doesn’t have an understanding of human behavior, and basic human differences in people. SO, when you do something he will misinterpret it and then gets angry. DO youth find yourself spending a lot of time trying to convince him that you didn’t mean something and aren’t trying to be a jerk?
What do you know about his other relationships? When he talks about his ex’s is he respectful of them or is he judgmental or even insulting of them. Most importantly, what is your gut telling you about moving forward and trying again with him? I look forward to hearing back from you!
Kanya
Hi Baily, It sounds as though the two of you had an open and honest conversation. Good job! I am glad that he shared his fears and hope that he is getting support working through them. The reality is, a lot of couples do get to 15-20 years and realize they don’t work anymore. I’ve been working with couples for over 20 years and there are similarities in the couples that get to that place. Usually they have had a career and a family and put the relationship on autopilot. They didn’t continue to nurture their connection or make time together as a couple a priority.
They’ve also stopped listening to each other or taking their partners needs seriously. As a result, they rarely feel heard, understood, or respected by each others. When this happens each person is less willing or interested in continuing to give, compromise, and sacrifice for the relationship. Many couples loss their unity and common goals. It is easy for this to happen but this can absolutely be avoided if people are willing to invest in the success of the relationship through the years.
This is something that your ex needs to work through and understand before he is ready. I am glad that he is open about the fact that he hasn’t healed at this point and wold most likely break up with you again if the two of you got back together now. Have you thought more about Heidi’s thoughts that you were relying on him too much to play many roles. There is a great book that I think might be interesting to you right now. It is called “How To Be an Adult in a Relationship.” It is filled with a lot of great information. One thing that I really resonate with is the idea that our partner can only satisfy a small amount of our needs. We also need family and friends and professional support at time, to get the rest of our needs met. Unfortunately, many of us rely on our partners too much and are disappointed when they can’t make us feel totally fulfilled. You mentioned that you saw him every night and spent several nights a week at his place. It sounds like the two of you were almost living together and it was too much too soon. If things were to progress in the future, would you be open to spending less time together if that worked better for him? I’m also wondering about ways to expand your social ties so that you aren’t at home waiting for him. What would options be for you to do so?
Kanya
