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Hi Heidi,
Your ideas are good, and I had not thought about the idea of an “interview” or how to get the answers that would reveal a man’s real nature. I have not yet actually started dating, but I suspect I will soon enough. What are your own non-negotiables?One comment: Probably this is normal for most ppl now, but my circumstances did not allow me to actually move in with my second husband until long after we had been together as a couple. Having my own place and not being dependent on him allowed me to have a place of retreat if anything was amiss. Only once did that come up and when I offered to go home instead of staying the rest of the weekend– he immediately changed his demeanor. He showed me a couple times that I really did mean more to him than his pride. I’m not sure it could have been as easily addressed had I not had an out.
I’m really proud of you for finding a way to get this man to reveal his true self! There was a situation with my second sweet man that I thought would end it for us. His beloved great-granddaughter was out to eat with us, four years old and not entirely onboard with Grandpa even touching me. (She would sit in her car seat behind us and say things like, “You have to keep both hands on the wheel, Grandpa!”) I thought we were making some progress, but he had to use the bathroom at the restaurant and took a long time. Meantime I was in charge of the little one, and something she did was not ok with me and I said so– and she rolled her eyes at me! I’ve raised 6 children and NEVER would they have dared to do that! So I slapped her face– knee-jerk reaction, and not a good one, I know, but the result was tears and sobs and she WOULD NOT QUIT! By the time he got out of the restroom I was so mad I had to leave and take a short walk to calm down. Since she was his little princess I thought I was for sure going to be in big trouble with him. He handled it well. I was just spending weekends with him at this point and was still thinking I would get reamed out (and not entirely without reason– I shouldn’t have slapped her) after I went home that weekend… he had not even brought it up. I couldn’t imagine that he wasn’t stewing over it somehow. Eventually I brought it up. His response was some variation of “I can love more than one person at a time!” It floored me. And over time this little girl and I became very close.
I can’t say I’d have been smart enough to engineer a situation like you described above! What a great idea, though.
I agree 100% that the “in love” chemicals in your brain are VERY addictive, and I understand fully why you also have been drawn in. Yet we know that is unsustainable, unreasonable, and often bad for us in the long run. All the usual things about who is supposed to be a match for you did not really matter for me. Both my husbands were very different than me in many ways, yet both good men and we had a good marriage. I came to think of myself as pretty malleable, able to fit with anyone. Not true, of course, and I don’t want to take stupid chances by believing that now.
So I thought I answered your question but must not have. Intimacy means a level of mutual transparency, willingness to be totally yourself from both parties. It is almost natural for a close girlfriend. Not so natural for a man, of course, as most men are not used to being that honest or vulnerable… or maybe I am generalizing.
One other thought, Heidi. I have had a man in my life since I was a teenager. It is not unlike having a pet. You don’t speak the same language, they don’t necessarily understand you fully, but it is so satisfying to care for them and try to understand them. When you lose a pet you can often get over it and get another. Not so easy with a human, and there’s no returning one that didn’t seem to click, sometimes.
Thanks, Heidi, I think I finally came to that realization, that I could not fix what was broken in him– but I tried until it was impossible to try any further. In some way I had to do what I could to restore the relationship, or at least I thought I had to. Thanks for that bit of truth. It is never up to us to fix someone else.
I enjoyed the feeling of falling in love, being in love. The beginning of my relationship to my second husband was intoxicating. Same with the man I was with that I recently quit seeing. There is a wonderful spark that is not reality, I realize, but is so encompassing. With my second husband I never really got over that. Our last year was no picnic; he was dying. But I loved taking care of him, just being with him.
I guess I’d have to say what is missing is the intimacy. I am now taking care of a couple people though not full-time. I do like to do that. Not the same as with him, but it is satisfying. With my husband the intimacy was no longer sexual (he was too ill) but in that situation he was so vulnerable and was willing for me to do for him all he needed done. He loved me and depended on me.
I’m no social butterfly. I don’t prefer to be in a crowd. But that close personal connection is something we all need. It is good that I have a few good friends to connect to. I am less and less in “need” of a man, and I know that is a good thing.
Heidi, that makes perfect sense, and I am trying to do just that. I do enjoy my own company, most of the time– occasionally am bored, but that’s where the growth can come, looking for something that is fun and can add to my “repertoire” of ways to be useful or engage. Of course it is a plus that anything you do to keep active mentally, socially, or physically also helps your brain.
I did look at Meetup and see there is some hiking groups, and that would be fun. Still looking at some of the other options. Again, thanks for the suggestion.
One thing I do love about James’s site is that while the carrot is often a suggestion of instant success somehow, he does not actually operate that way, and I love the down to earth REAL ideas that just help me see aspects of interpersonal relationships I may not have thought about before. Your suggestions above fit that ideal. Yes, it was not possible to help my first husband feel useful once the kids were old enough to be able to be more independent, and yet I might have tried the small things more… I did not tell you the whole story. Suffice it to say I know I did what I could as long as I could, as confusing as it was, and nothing you do is ever a waste! I learned so much.
1. Both my husbands were wonderful men. My first husband was a great father, too, and I have 6 children bc of him, three born to me, three “borrowed” (adopted). So many interesting and unusual experiences bc of this man who was creative, interesting, kind. Unfortunately after many years of marriage he ceased to feel needed and started to look elsewhere, and eventually was diagnosed with Bipolar II. We divorced eventually but stayed together– it was so hard for me to emotionally separate. Eventually when he actually married again I moved out and took a break from men. Husband 2 I had met and loved a few years earlier but broke up with, hoping to repair the first relationship somehow. After a year alone I contacted him and we got back together. I traveled to be with him on weekends; my job was too far away to daily commute. When he was ultimately dying from cancer we actually married (we had been together for ten years already). He wanted me to have his Social Security. I had quit my job and moved in shortly before, and we had almost a year together before he died. This man I deeply miss, still grieve. He had a wicked sense of humor, was deeply kind and gracious, generous, and loved me so much. He has provided for me in so many ways, even being gone.
2. What do I feel is missing? Well, after spending most of my life centering on a man it is natural to want that back, at least to want a good man in my life again. I am finding out so much I enjoy with volunteering and helping my sister with her finances, and I know I can and should expand upon that. I do like sex. That’s less easily done alone, and I recognize that I am not capable of casual sex. Tried that– got so attached to someone so quickly who cannot be a real partner for many reasons. When you marry very young and did not explore relationships it is a surprise to find out your true parameters! In today’s dating world I don’t know how this could play out. Hopefully there are possible matches out there close enough to my age to both meet my needs and also not want just a fling? And in today’s society it is probably common for both parties to enjoy the sex apart from any need of permanency. I thought that would be likely for me– nope.
I like your idea of meetup.com. Could be a lot of fun and no pressure. Thanks.
I see what you are saying about a man needing to feel a purpose, to be needed. My first husband really is evidence enough of that. He taught me to be independent, then was out of a job! I still needed him desperately emotionally but that wasn’t enough.
