[Huyen H]

Hi Spyce,

Nice to e-meet you!

I’m still stuck in the same house with my ex but I’ve been applying what Heidi showed me. Life has been manageable. However I’m also conscious to not burn myself out. I’m trying not to participate in any argument but gosh it’s so hard sometimes!
eg. I already cooked lunch for both of us but he just told me last minute “I don’t need lunch today”. so I simply replied “it would be great if you can let me know next time if you don’t need lunch or dinner cooked”
He immediately took it as an attack and started yelling at me “See, this is what I’m talking about. Why do you have to be angry?! I have an important meeting to go to!!”
I told him “I’m not angry, Im just asking that if you can be more considerate of me the next time” and he just kept saying “YOU ARE ANGRY!!”

How should I have respond in this case? Maybe what I said sound harsher than what I intended? I want to learn to communicate my needs. And How should I diffuse an argument when it already started?
Cheers
Huyen

[Huyen H]

Thanks Heidi. You are right, I don’t need to play into it & participate in this energy draining argument. I felt pretty upset about what he wrote in the email. I just can’t get how he can blatantly blame everything on me & have such a strong belief that everything was my fault. I try not to let it affect me too much. They are his thought & belief and I have no control over it…
In a way, I’m glad that he realized that he is full of anger & vengeance and for the time being, he just wants to focus on himself. Whether he will do something about it, is another story. But at the end of the day, I hope he will find his inner peace soon.

My Dad wrote him back a very long email that I dont think he will take it well… so we will see…

On the other hand, everything else is going pretty well. I continue to re-invent myself 🙂 Just signed up for swimming & sewing courses. I have also said yes to going out on Fri night to a new group of friends! It’s scary , I’m very much an introvert! But i told myself Why not!!

Have a good week ahead
Huyen

[Huyen H]

To give you a bit of context in the part “To her, I’m just an outsider. I was never part of the family for her. You can ask Huyen why I said this. Last September, I asked her some questions, how she answered my question to tell me Huyen had never seen me as a family. When you ask her, I hope she will tell you the full story. Because when I ask her the same questions now, she changes her answers.” .
he referred to the question that his dad mentioned in his letter: What if he does something illegal, would I report him? He uses this example to say that I don’t know what marriage is about, that I never seen him as family because I hesitated when he asked what if it was my Dad. I knew what he wanted from asking me this hypothetical question. This is straight after he bought a car despite me telling him we don’t need a 3rd car for 2 person household. He just want to test if i have this “blind loyalty” like his friends. He wanted me to say that no matter how his decision is right or wrong, I have to support him. Well, at least that’s what went through my head…

Im interested to see your point of view, from a counselor’s perspective, what is your take on this?

Cheers
Huyen

[Huyen H]

HI Heidi,

I have replied back to his dad, basically just acknowledged him & says I appreciate his advice. I also said he was right in pointing out my mistakes & misstep in the past. I didn’t mention anything about the donation or his view on Western vs. Oriental thinking. There is no point because that’s what he believes in. I just own up my part & if he thinks his son has nothing to do with this marriage failure, he can.

Since then, my ex husband has sent an email to my Dad. I’m interested in what you think about this. To me it’s pretty much still the same thing, I have to change and he doesn’t. Am I reading this right?

Thanks
Huyen

Dear Father

I don’t want to call you dad anymore because I’m angry. I’m better now. Me and Huyen are together or not, as long as you treat me like your own child, I’ll call you dad.

Besides my anger, I also felt I had failed. I feel lost. Because this is not the plan I had. We’ve been a team all our lives together… Now it’s just me.

After getting married, everyone said… “remember your wife is always right!!” But at what cost? My mental health is suffering. At what point is acceptable, I have to love myself first to love others.

When you ask me “is my love big enough to go through everything with Huyen”. That’s not the point. You should ask Huyen the same question. I never felt like i was her husband. She doesn’t understand what marriage is. To her, I’m just an outsider. I was never part of the family for her. You can ask Huyen why I said this. Last September, I asked her some questions, how she answered my question to tell me Huyen had never seen me as a family. When you ask her, I hope she will tell you the full story. Because when I ask her the same questions now, she changes her answers.

I’ve heard about the scam you’ve come across. You don’t need to apologize for not starting us. I never want anything from you. It’s me who’s really sorry. I’m not smart enough and talented enough to make more money. She’s my ex-wife, but that doesn’t mean I don’t care about her. The money I promised her was very little. I’m a man it’s a shame to only be able to make that little money in the last 8 years we’ve been together. My dad never got anything from him, so he did the same to the kids. He donates a lot of money to temples and charities. He probably won’t inherit anything for me. I should have told you this before you let me take Huyen to NZ. hahaha I’m just glad there’s a house to live in.

I thought about give her another chance. My parents and many of my friends wished us back together. It wasn’t an easy decision for me.

Two possibilities if we get back together:

1. I became Huyen … users “Break up” to achieve what they want. If Huyen disagrees with me, I’ll do what she does. I didn’t speak to her for weeks and waited until she apologized. Because I have a lot of anger and I just want revenge. In 2020, I became Huyen. I hate it. I just did it because I didn’t know how to deal with her.

2. Huyen become me…. who never uses “Farewell” to achieve what he wants. A person does not speak to each other for weeks and waits for apologies. Someone can take it and give it to you. A person understands what marriage means. Accept to really accept each other’s shortcomings. It’s easier to move mountains than to change. It doesn’t mean she can’t, but first she has to really accept me. Accept everything about me. Everything she hates about me. And this takes time.

It’s not just Huyen who needs to decide to change. I have to learn to forgive her, too. Really forgive her. The last 8 years have made me a bitter man, a man without patience, prone to anger. There are a lot of bad memories that take time to heal.

In short… I’ll never know unless I try. But now is not the time. If we get back together now, I can assure you that 2020 will repeat itself.

Ask Huyen, ask her what she wants. And towards it. If she wants this relationship. Prepare him mentally. Show me her pride is something she can let go when it comes to little things. If she wants a divorce, let her. No need to say… this letter clarifies my intention.

Tell you something… on a late night, Huyen was walking alone when he saw a drunk guy tellingting racist comments. The comments don’t even go toward Huyen. He’s just talking to himself. Huyen came to him and scolded him. It’s like 10 p.m., and that guy’s a U.S. military veteran and has mental problems after any war he wants. At the time, her pride was betrayed. Your daughter may have been injured or something worse that night. I could hear a bit of chaos of the conversation from my office so I ran outside. When I got out, the guy was apologizing to her. It’s not me why he’s sorry, it’s Huyen. Huyen is definitely formidable. I’ve always wondered what Huyen’s previous life was… can be an army leader, a warrior, a bodyguard, a possible gangster. No problem, I admire her for that. I just hope she makes the right choices, not the wrong wars. If she knew it, our relationship could have been salvageable.

Another reason I don’t like writing to you is, I just feel like I’m complaining about your daughter. I welcome any criticism from you or Huyen.

[Huyen H]

Hi Heidi, his dad just wrote me an email and I don’t know what to write back. Help!! It’s in Chinese so I’ve tried my best to translate it. If anything doesn’t make sense, please let me know:

“Looking at you and Jesse from a very loving husband and wife until today that you both want to separate as a parent I felt very sad & hard to accept. Naturally in this world, everyone has their own flaws, you both don’t understand each other.
I have tried to understand both of your perspectives so I got some information from my son. This is what Jesse said:
– all these years, it’s always you who want to separate and you always initiated a cold war. In order to end cold war, he needs to give in all the time. Even when he wasn’t wrong, he apologized. You are a very strong willed woman. Because of that,Jesse has lost dignity of being a husband & the man of the house. Jesse is really sad because he is trying to love you but it is so hard to do it.
Because you always said break up, he cannot believe that you really love him. Why do you want to torture the man that you love because of small issues? Jesse thinks his biggest mistake is from when you guys first started going out until marriage, he always give in, tries to please you, and it makes you to be more dictated and stronger will. Have you ever stand in his shoes and think about his feeling as the man of the house?
Previously Jesse did ask me for advice & I always told him to tolerate and forgive as the man. Because giving in for the woman you love is not something bad, and it will indeed improve your relationship. that’s how I treat my wife. And Jesse replied: Yes I know, but when the matters are small, mom decides but when it’s big, mom respects your decision. However Huyen is not like that.
Ofcourse all these are just from Jesse. People often can only see other people’s flaw and never sit down to see what they have done. And because I’m his father I know how much flaws that he has. And definitely he is not perfect. So are we. But the most important thing in marriage is to tolerate and to think on behalf of others & put yourself in their shoes.
I’m old and I have been doing a lot of good deeds for the Buddist Society . In Buddishm , it’s it taught that everything happens for a reason. Recently I have been doing more charity work, and I’m building 2000 sqm multipurpose hall. I need to raise a lot of money but because of covid, cashflow is a bit tight for everyone. It’s hard to get donation. So I had no choice to ask for help from Jesse . Without hesitation, Jesse agreed to send $4000 but after a few days, Jesse said he only can send 2000 because Huyen is needing the money to do charity in VN as well. So I told Jesse it’s ok I’m very happy that Huyen is doing charity. To me 4000 or 2000 is not much difference. Justin (his brother) has also donated money to the temple. Both Jesse and Justin understands that their father will never ever ask for money from them and this is probably the first time. So Huyen, in this matter I realized that you are strong. And at that moment I can hear Jesse’s sadness and he seems helpless. Huyen can you actually understand a dignity of a man who had to disappoint his father? (What actually happened was that he never told me he wanted to send $4000 back home to his dad. he only told me $2000 and I said yes immediately. I think because I wanted to send money back at the same time, Jesse decided to cut back on the donation to his dad. But it sounds like the Dad thinks I stopped him?)

Another thing I thought I should let you know so that you learnt as well. There was one time Jesse watched a movie & Jesse trying to use a scenario in the movie to test your love for him. Will you report him if he does something illegal & you said yes. And this thing has impacted him greatly and makes him wonder if you really love him? Is it wise to do it like that Huyen? Don’t you know if you report to the police it will destroy him?
And then Jesse asked you if the criminal is someone very close to you in VN, will you call the police? And you didn’t answer. You didn’t answer that means you know you shouldn’t call the police. Why didn’t you apologize to him right after that? And this matter also proves that you are very strong. And a strong person will never apologize. (To give you a bit of context, I knew what he wanted from asking me this hypothetical question. This is straight after he bought a car despite me telling him we don’t need a 3rd car for 2 person household. He just want to test if i have this “blind loyalty” like his friends. He wanted me to say that no matter how his decision is right or wrong, I have to support him. Well, at least that’s what went through my head…)

Huyen this is all from Jesse alone. And I’m pretty sure you have been treated badly to a point that you want to leave. Please understand this letter is not to blame you in anyway. It is to help you to see the situation from his perspective. If you still love him, all you need to do is to “lay low”, change your attitude & I believe you both can be happy together again. Jesse has been suppressed for so long that he is trying to distant away from you more than he wants to love you. He actually still loves you. Im not sure if you believe this but there is a saying “Only the weak man can tolerate a strong wife”. In Oriental thinking, we always have to think of a man’s dignity/ego . In Western thinking, men and women are equal. It doesn’t mean the Western culture is not right but the divorce rate is high. I do not disagree equality between women & men but I hope you can think & apply the oriental culture ”

I want to explain to him about the donation. I’m not sure if there is a point in explaining him my view of a marriage? I basically want to keep a good relationship with his Dad.
What should I write back?

thanks
Huyen

[Huyen H]

Hi Heidi, thanks for checking in. Things have been amicable between us. I apply your advices and basically just try to inspire the best in him: talk to him nicely, ask for his opinions, even gave him a gift (he wanted to frame his qualifications for a long time but never got around to do it. When he was away I just did it for him). That was well received by him.
Leading up to our Lunar New Year, instead of telling him what to do, I just said “hey, it would be amazing if you could help me to do ABC. I know you’ve been extremely busy, so anytime is ok as long as it’s before NYE. But don’t worry if you can’t,
just let me know and we can think of sth else.” He ended up finishing the whole list I asked him to do. Win!! Ofcourse I followed up with a big thank you and lots of compliments.
It has not been always that easy, sometimes I feel like his resentment/anger resurfaces and he would make a provoking comment. For example I asked him to do something nicely and he said No, don’t order me around. But as you said, I have to MANAGE the situation so I just bit my tongue and didn’t make a big deal out of it.
His Dad rang him on New Year Day and told him he wants us to work it out. He also told him that his request of “if we get back together, you need to let me decide everything” is unreasonable. To that he explained himself to me that “you know where I’m coming from right? I’m not going to abuse it, I just don’t want to have to fight or ask for your opinion over small things”. I didn’t say anything because it just proves that he still doesn’t value what is important to me. It might be trivial to him, but what if it matters to me? Heidi, am I reading this right?

He asked me to go with him to a birthday party which most people came as couples. I understand the reason why he asked. It’s quite a tricky situation when you are surrounded by couples,and it sucks having to explain why you are by yourself. I politely declined as I had other plan that night but said I might be able to come to the after party. It turned out to be a really good night. I miss hanging out with our couple friends (they are his friends first so I haven’t been able to see them for quite a while). We toasted for friendship or flatmateship or whatever it is called between us two. Our friends told us they are happy to see we can keep things civilized, and they will never take side. They just want to see us happy either together or sepperately.
From what I wrote above, anything in my communications or actions should I have done differently?
Thanks
Huyen

[Huyen H]

Thanks Heidi, absolutely !
Have a good weekend:)
Huyen

[Huyen H]

Got it! Thanks Heidi. I will apply this and keep you updated

Cheers
Huyen

[Huyen H]

Hi Heidi,

Sorry to confuse you!! What I meant is deep down I still have feeling for him & want us to work. But I know it’s not gonna happen, so yes I’m ready to let go.

Thanks 🙂
Huyen

[Huyen H]

Hey Heidi, we must have posted at the same time! I didn’t see your reply until after sending mine.
Yes, his text made me feel good, but I’m also aware of the words he used. He didn’t say he miss me, he just miss the things we used to do together. It actually doesn’t mean anything, he most likely was bored or lonely. he texted me in the morning and explained that he had pot last night and it amplified the feelings “Like you miss someone a little then after smoking you feel that feeling grown 10 times” . Thank goodness I didn’t say anything lol
To be completely honest with you, I want to try one last time. BUT ONLY IF he is willing to work through this with me. You have made it quite clear that the chance is pretty low for it, nothing or no one can make it happen, it has to come from him. I don’t want a mediocre relationship. I dont want to go back to a toxic marriage. So yes, I’m ready to let go.
Please show me how I can keep things amicable with him during this time
Thanks Heidi
Huyen

[Huyen H]

Hi Heidi, latest update, my ex is out of town with his best friend and he texted me this last night “Travelling without you really feels not right. I really miss the things we do together”
What should I reply ? I’m planning to just send him a smile emotional and leave it as that

[Huyen H]

Hi Heidi, thanks for checking in. I’ve been learning to get in touch with myself, my needs, what exactly what I want in life. I want to be happy!! At the moment, I can’t see how I will ever be whole again and it might take a very long time but I need to understand that it’s better to go through this pain once and for all.
I have recently found comfort in taking care of my spiritual wellbeing, an aspect that I have neglected for a long time. This is what I’m planning to continue exploring & developing.
To be honest, it’s still very raw but whenever I have a second thought, I opened up my phone and read your advices over and over again .
The only thing I’m struggling with is how to communicate with my ex while we are still living under one roof. I try my best not to make the situation worse but he often takes almost everything as an attack. For example: I asked him the bills for last month so that I can contribute half of it. He told me not to worry about it, just take care of the Grocery to which I pointed out that Grocery is way more than Bill… And he just lost the plot, started talking about I’m counting cents with him now, what about when he earned way more than me before, that I still don’t get it and never will, that’s why we can’t be together. Am I wrong? Am I counting cents? How can I better communicate with a person that is still holding so much anger? I found myself avoiding confrontation , avoid raising my opinion because I just want some peace around the house when we are still stuck together.
Recently we got into a massive argument over his best friend, a guy that part of me blame him for our marriage failure. Just to give you a bit of a background, he is the rich bachelor that I mentioned earlier. They have been best friends since 13 y.o. Before COVID, he resides in a different country and only comes back for a holiday every Christmas. He expects everything has to remain the same way as when he left the country 10 years ago, ie. everyday hanging out at his house, smoking weed, drinking and having a good time. He doesn’t realise that people move on, they have their own life, own family. Now with COVID, he moved back here permanently and that wasn’t in any way helping our rocky relationship.. I know I shouldn’t blame him or spend any of my energy hating him but it’s hard not to!
When we first broke up, he came over to my house and tell me that “I think it’s better that you guys part way. You guys are not a good match. The quicker you move out of the house, the better it is”. Recently, he has reached out to me and told me that my ex has been “taking it out on him”, “being aggressive” toward him, and being rude to him. I didn’t want to encourage the conversation further because I didn’t want any drama & whatever happened between them, they have to sort it out themselves.
I finally told my ex about his best friend’s action. I said “No doubt he’s got your back, but he is a narcissist. As soon as it affects him, he would not be able to take it. As your friend, why did he come to your ex wife and complained about your behaviour? Wouldn’t it better to raise it with you? ”. To that, he defended his best friend’s behaviour “Yes, my best friend is an a*hole. He is a narcissist but I chose to love him and see him as a brother. We go through that cycle of he is doing something that pisses me off and we don’t talk for months. But I have blind loyalty. We will still be brothers at the end of the day”. I did read this in James’ book and this can’t be any more accurate!! And he got mad at me again for not telling him immediately… lol!
On the same night, as we are already talking, I told him I don’t appreciate how he talks to me recently, at least treats me with a respect for a flatmate. Stop bringing me down to prove his point. To that he said
-HIM: “Oh, I have to say things the way it is right. I want you to learn something out of this relationship. When you asked me to give us a chance, you said “US”, not “ME”. It just proves that you haven’t learned anything!! You still blame me for what happened”
– ME: “You’re so full of anger that even just a word that I used, you have to over-analyse it and turned it into an attack. In no way Im blaming you for what happened. I used “Us” because it’s OUR relationship, it takes 2 to tango. That’s it!”
– HIM “In a way you are just like my friend, egotistical, self centred and selfish”
– ME: “Can you elaborate it further? What have I done to make you think so?”
And then he came back to my “manipulation” again. I didn’t want to participate in the argument any further because it’s going nowhere so I just acknowledged that I have done many thing wrong in the past . I haven’t been a good partner to you and I’m sorry!
And then he said “To be honest I feel like a failure”
Sorry for the rant Heidi!! From the conversation above, is there anything I can improve on? Is there anything I shouldn’t have said or done to make the situation worst? My main goal is to keep things amicable between us for at least the next 3 months.

Thanks so much
Huyen

[Huyen H]

Thank you Heidi. I now know what to do. Hopefully in a near future I can be back here and update you on how far have I healed and progressed 🙂
Huyen

[Huyen H]

Heidi, you opened up my mind!

Somehow I believed I have turned him into this bitter, angry husband who sees everything I got to say as an attempt to challenge him. I’m well aware of the mistakes that I have made but you’re right, I cannot make him be anything. About 2 years ago, when I started standing up for myself, he did say that “he will learn to treat me equally & try to get rid of his Patriarchal way of thinking”. I believe he did want to try, but at the end of the day, it is AGAINST his core belief and mission in life. This IS the reason why we have struggled for so long as a couple. Of all this time, I knew it, but my love (or stubbornness?!?) is so strong that just keeps pulling me back to him. It’s almost as bad as an addiction!!

You asked what would make me still want to keep connecting to a guy like him? I don’t know Heidi… I could only think of the good times, happy memories, how we used to be as a couple. On the other hand, I knew I did him wrong and the endless thought of “what ifs”, “if only”,” I wish” keep haunting me day & night. I can’t stand a thought of him being with another woman or moving on without me. Valentine is coming up, our anniversary, etc. I feel like losing a part of my identity, the dream, the hope , the future that I’ve imagined with him in it. I feel like a failure ..

I know getting over a heartbreak is not an overnight process. Besides leaning on my support network, keeping myself occupied, what’s the best way to silent the thoughts at night? what’s the best way to break that break up – make up cycle?

Huyen

[Huyen H]

Hi Heidi,

Thank you so much for getting back to me. I haven’t replied to his text, I didn’t know what to respond to not make the situation worse. I just continue to treat him normally… It has been 2 days, is it a bit too late to send what you recommended? Or should I just sit down & talk to him?

Your advice has made me think a lot. You’re right on the money on the feeling existed in him long before I came along. His ex left him because he wasn’t financially secured enough for her, his dad chose his brother to be the heir of the family instead of him. His clients are all rich & successful businessman, his best friend is a rich bachelor who hasn’t worked a single day in his life. His biggest desire since I’ve known him is to make it one day to the top & earn his dad’s respect. From my observation, he has always been the underdog in the outside world & at home, he wants to be the boss, the Alpha male. He also grows up in a family where the man makes all of the decisions and the woman just follows.
When I asked him if we could have another chance, this was what he said “only if you let me make all the decision, no matter how big or small”. He once said ” I provide, I don’t cheat, I don’t gamble, I’m not an addict, so what I’ve done to you (referring to abusive comments) is trivial”.
I myself was raised to be a proud, independent woman. I’m capable and I believe in equality. After reading James’ book I realized I have approached this wrong. Instead of tapping into his desire of being the provider, I’ve used it against me. Whenever there is an argument, I would try to prove him wrong, make him understand that I don’t need him to provide, I’m more than OK to take care of myself.
He blamed me to turn him into a “monster”, he wasn’t like that in the beginning of our relationship, it’s because of all my manipulation. He was invested and a loving, caring boyfriend. I don’t actually know if that’s true, or it’s just him & his Partriarchial ideology that gets us in the end.

From what you said, yes I want to make it work but can we re-build the bridge and come to a happy medium? To be honest, I don’t want to be in the relationship that I’m not heard and respected. I’m scared that as you said, even if we get back together, as soon as something happens, he would jump back to his old self.
Is there anything else I can do to help him release his anger? Or the best thing to do is to have compassion & wait if he turns around? Would he ever turn around..?

Thank you
Huyen

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